Spiritual Depression Due To Vain Discernment

[Studiumecclesiae]

[b]Dear All,
[/b]
Thank you for your interesting messages.
I know the Order, I have no problems with my parents. I know I am meant to be a nun (I think).
But the problem is that I have no spiritual director at the moment, as I keep moving out, travelling, etc. It's impossible.
Though I always contact the Vocation Office everytime I move in somewhere.

The problem is when I visit communities. It happens that a community seems to be "the right one" and when I get there I get over-sensitive and every thing that don't appeal to me break my heart and I just turn away to go to another place. I keep thinking that if I am frustrated before entering, it shall carry on, as I am after strict papal enclosure.

I want the perfect community, with strict enclosure, etc. I have a pre-vatican II conception of the Religious Life and every time a community seems very traditional, when I look closer and see it's not "that", I just turn away.
At some point, I feel put-off. Because I've travelled too far now. Now I am fed-up. Lukewarm. I've given up lots of good habits since then.

I'll try to get more steady in prayer. I might visit another community, but I'll try not to have too much hope. Disappointment is killing me.

[i]StudiumEcclesiae[/i]

[Cherie]

Prayers for you in your discernment.

[quote name='Studiumecclesiae' timestamp='1306315367' post='2245698']

I want the perfect community, with strict enclosure, etc. I have a pre-vatican II conception of the Religious Life and every time a community seems very traditional, when I look closer and see it's not "that", I just turn away.
At some point, I feel put-off. Because I've travelled too far now. Now I am fed-up. Lukewarm. I've given up lots of good habits since then.

[/quote]

I worked a lot with the Vocation Directress of my former community, and in my experience, I have come across many discerners who feel similarly. I would encourage you to realize that there truly is NO "perfect community." Yes, if God is calling you to religious life, there is a community that is perfect [i]for you,[/i] but if someone goes out to seek a "perfect community," that fits every single one of their preconceived ideas of religious life or what a community "should be" in every way, they will leave being sorely disappointed, as it truly does not exist.

It often helps to remember that God allows these deviations from our "picture perfect" community for our benefit. If everything is "perfect," if it's practically a utopia for us, how can we truly grow in virtue? The only way one can practice patience is being in a situation in which we're inclined to be [i]impatient;[/i] in the same way, one can try to be completely conformed to God's will, but the only way one can [i]truly[/i] give our own will completely over to God's Will in religious life is if there are certain aspects of the life--however small-- that go against [i]our own will,[/i] so we can offer it up and become more closely conformed to God's will. It's often the most difficult aspect of religious life.

I remember learning the most difficult thing, the thing that sets religious MOST apart from the world isn't actually celibacy - it's [i]willingly[/i] giving up our free will in order to conform it to God's. Free will is a wonderful gift from God! But religious willingly offer it up, [i]willingly [/i]choose to obey a human Superior who is the "mediator" of God's will for them. It may be the most difficult thing, but it is also the most rewarding -- how much more quickly a religious will grow in virtue as a result of giving up their own will, than a person "in the world" who can do whatever they want at any time!

I would encourage you to realize that there [i]will[/i] be parts of any community that don't appeal to you. That's just the way it is; no community ever fully fits one's "dream" of the perfect community. Some get pretty darn close, it's true, and that's how many realize they are called to a specific community. But God will use those "unappealing" parts to help you grow in virtue and bring you closer to Him. It is one aspect of conforming our wills to His.

[AccountDeleted]

[quote name='CherieMadame' timestamp='1306320719' post='2245712']
Prayers for you in your discernment.



I worked a lot with the Vocation Directress of my former community, and in my experience, I have come across many discerners who feel similarly. I would encourage you to realize that there truly is NO "perfect community." Yes, if God is calling you to religious life, there is a community that is perfect [i]for you,[/i] but if someone goes out to seek a "perfect community," that fits every single one of their preconceived ideas of religious life or what a community "should be" in every way, they will leave being sorely disappointed, as it truly does not exist.

It often helps to remember that God allows these deviations from our "picture perfect" community for our benefit. If everything is "perfect," if it's practically a utopia for us, how can we truly grow in virtue? The only way one can practice patience is being in a situation in which we're inclined to be [i]impatient;[/i] in the same way, one can try to be completely conformed to God's will, but the only way one can [i]truly[/i] give our own will completely over to God's Will in religious life is if there are certain aspects of the life--however small-- that go against [i]our own will,[/i] so we can offer it up and become more closely conformed to God's will. It's often the most difficult aspect of religious life.

I remember learning the most difficult thing, the thing that sets religious MOST apart from the world isn't actually celibacy - it's [i]willingly[/i] giving up our free will in order to conform it to God's. Free will is a wonderful gift from God! But religious willingly offer it up, [i]willingly [/i]choose to obey a human Superior who is the "mediator" of God's will for them. It may be the most difficult thing, but it is also the most rewarding -- how much more quickly a religious will grow in virtue as a result of giving up their own will, than a person "in the world" who can do whatever they want at any time!

I would encourage you to realize that there [i]will[/i] be parts of any community that don't appeal to you. That's just the way it is; no community ever fully fits one's "dream" of the perfect community. Some get pretty darn close, it's true, and that's how many realize they are called to a specific community. But God will use those "unappealing" parts to help you grow in virtue and bring you closer to Him. It is one aspect of conforming our wills to His.
[/quote]

Absolutely wonderful advice here - what I wanted to say but you said it so well!

The only thing I would like to add is that even if you do find what you consider to be the 'perfect community', you might not be the 'perfect match' in their minds! It's hard to say, but I found the community where I wanted to live forever but they didn't want me there... this is a relationship, not a shopping expedition. And God doesn't let any of us off the hook - we aren't perfect, we need perfecting, and sometimes this means realizing that our idea of perfection and His aren't the same thing!!

I will keep you in my prayers to find your home in religion. I am still trying to find mine so I know how hard it is. But if you give up, then that says something about you, not the communities that didn't live up to your standards. I'm not saying not to stick to your ideal, of course do the best you can, but if this is going to be a 'my way or the highway' attitude, then perhaps God is just testing your perseverence? I have given up discerning from time to time, so I know how it feels to be too discouraged and tired to keep on trying, but what's the alternative? If you're like Jeremiah, the burning in your heart won't let you give up!

If you feel called to marriage, then fine, but don't give up just because it's hard! Jesus fell three times and kept going until He reached His glory.... look to Him.

Edited May 25, 2011 by nunsense

[Studiumecclesiae]

Don't worry. Now my ideal of the Religious Life is fulfilled. I [u][b]have found[/b][/u] the right community.
I wish to enter soon, but I need to have another life-in before.

My "depression" is over, I thought such a traditional way of life didn't exist. I didn't want to try in the traditionalistic basket.
Didn't need to, because there are as traditional communities with the Paul VI's mass in latin, the office of Prime, strict papal enclosure, etc.

[i][b][size="7"][color="#ff0000"]Deo Gratias!![/color][/size][/b][/i]

[HopefulBride]

[quote name='Studiumecclesiae' timestamp='1309521890' post='2261506']
Don't worry. Now my ideal of the Religious Life is fulfilled. I [u][b]have found[/b][/u] the right community.
I wish to enter soon, but I need to have another life-in before.

My "depression" is over, I thought such a traditional way of life didn't exist. I didn't want to try in the traditionalistic basket.
Didn't need to, because there are as traditional communities with the Paul VI's mass in latin, the office of Prime, strict papal enclosure, etc.

[i][b][size="7"][color="#ff0000"]Deo Gratias!![/color][/size][/b][/i]
[/quote]

Are you referring to the Benedictines? They are a [i]wonderful [/i]community. If the Lord had called me to enclosure it would be either with the Benedictines (Mary Queen of Apostles) or the Carmelites of Valpraiso. these sisters.

[Studiumecclesiae]

Yes they're benedictines. I also hesitated between Carmel and the OSB at some point but they're very different.
Enclosure is stricter in Carmel. You're completely hidden from the world. I've seen great extremes in France.
the Benedictines can also be very enclosed but you can still see them behind the grilles (no big curtain) and they share their outstanding liturgy with all the world!! The Carmelites sing on one note and are meant to have a bare liturgy.
One is a "royal" way (the benedictines) and the other way is the way of the cross.
Both focus on penance, but the Benedictines have a more interior form of penance.

I have always been attracted to the Benedictines, more than any other order. I am so happy I found the right community!

[FutureSister2009]

I was feeling better this morning but I'm still depressed deep down

[HopefulBride]

[quote name='FutureSister2009' timestamp='1309539031' post='2261615']
I was feeling better this morning but I'm still depressed deep down
[/quote]

Prayers for you FutureSister

[Yaatee]

[quote name='Studiumecclesiae' timestamp='1309536559' post='2261595']
Yes they're benedictines. I also hesitated between Carmel and the OSB at some point but they're very different.
Enclosure is stricter in Carmel. You're completely hidden from the world. I've seen great extremes in France.
the Benedictines can also be very enclosed but you can still see them behind the grilles (no big curtain) and they share their outstanding liturgy with all the world!! The Carmelites sing on one note and are meant to have a bare liturgy.
One is a "royal" way (the benedictines) and the other way is the way of the cross.
Both focus on penance, but the Benedictines have a more interior form of penance.

I have always been attracted to the Benedictines, more than any other order. I am so happy I found the right community!
[/quote]

Want to tell us which congregation?

I too, have always been attracted to the Benedictines. .

[Studiumecclesiae]

Some Benedictines of the Solesmes congregation. (to know the specific monastery, I can tell via PM)
They are very very orthodox, very strict but not traditionalist. I found the perfect balance.
I am overjoyed.

Now I am praying for all discerners here so that they may find the right community too. You need time and patience.
Once you've found the right order, then you need to visit several before you get to the right one. Unless you exactly know what you want.
I had strict, narrow criteria, and I found rather quickly. I am so glad.

[Chamomile]

Here's something interesting and thorough about acedia:

[url="http://www.pathsoflove.com/acedia/cassian-acedia.html"]St. John Cassian on Acedia[/url]


Maybe reading that will help some who are struggling with it. And I think everyone who is trying to live a spiritual life will, at some point, struggle with this temptation.

[MithLuin]

Congratulations on finding a community, [b]Studium Ecclasiae[/b]! You sound very excited . Sometimes, having very specific criteria can mean that you are setting yourself up for disappointment...as you are creating an 'ideal' community divorced from reality. Other times, it means that God is calling you to something very particular, and you just have to keep searching, searching, searching to find it.

And sometimes (though rarely), you are being called to start an order ~ now that is scary!

I sometimes wonder if discerners sometimes look at the people who visit one of the 'popular' communities - Nashville Dominicans, CFRs, Sisters of Life, etc - and after this one visit to this one group know they have found their new home....with a bit of jealousy. After all, for others, the search is a bit more convoluted, and nowhere seems like home, or a place does, but after entering, it doesn't work out. This bumpy road is also quite common, and I guess it's just important to keep in mind that God has lessons that can only be learned through such difficulty. Perseverence is key.

[Studiumecclesiae]

Dear all,

Back in my spiritual depression due to "vain discernment". Well I just found out I don't feel that the cloistered life is appropriate for me.
So I must start all my discernment again. I don't feel like. I feel a bit sick about everything, and strengthless. But I'll have to carry on seeking God's will.
I bet it happened to many of you, discovering you were discerning with the wrong state of life, the wrong religious order, the wrong community. It's terribly frustrating. Like having a fiancé and then telling him we aren't going any further, you aren't the right man.

[HopefulBride]

[quote name='Studiumecclesiae' timestamp='1318785480' post='2322117']
Dear all,

Back in my spiritual depression due to "vain discernment". Well I just found out I don't feel that the cloistered life is appropriate for me.
So I must start all my discernment again. I don't feel like. I feel a bit sick about everything, and strengthless. But I'll have to carry on seeking God's will.
I bet it happened to many of you, discovering you were discerning with the wrong state of life, the wrong religious order, the wrong community. It's terribly frustrating. Like having a fiancé and then telling him we aren't going any further, you aren't the right man.
[/quote]

Dear SE,

Prayers for you as you continue to seek to do his will. I am inspired by your perseverance and your desire to know and do the Lord's will.

Pax,
HB

[Lisa]

Don't forget that we are praying for you! And, think of it this way: if you've discerned a particular community, charism, spirituality, or way of life isn't for you, then you've eliminated some choices and gotten closer to discerning His Will. It's not necessarily the fastest way to discern it, but it's still fruitful!