Affirmative Action

[Winchester]

[quote name='Mr.CatholicCat' timestamp='1305397543' post='2241432']
Don John of Austria lost then... scroll back.

But I will take my leave of this discussion, I find it irritating to be mocked by asking for explanation. Maybe sincerity is lacking. In either event. Pardon me.
[/quote]
No, because you didn't think to invoke it until I did and you then googled it and learned what "Godwin's Law" is.

You're leaving because you made an idiot of yourself not knowing what an analogy is.

[Mr.Cat]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305397826' post='2241440']No, because you didn't think to invoke it until I did and you then googled it and learned what "Godwin's Law" is.

You're leaving because you made an idiot of yourself not knowing what an analogy is.[/quote]Could you please stop the personal attacks, slander, and lies for a moment? Thank you in advance.

And he did mention hitler first... I'm sorry that bothers you.

Edited May 14, 2011 by Mr.CatholicCat

[Winchester]

[quote name='Mr.CatholicCat' timestamp='1305397919' post='2241442']
Could you please stop the personal attacks, slander, and lies for a moment? Thank you in advance.[/quote]
Just matching tone. Stop playing victim.

[quote]And he did mention hitler first... I'm sorry that bothers you.
[/quote]

I didn't say he didn't. I said you didn't invoke the law, so too bad. The Geneva Convention dealt with this a few years ago.

[Mr.Cat]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305398282' post='2241446']Just matching tone. Stop playing victim.[/quote]Good imagination.[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305398282' post='2241446']I didn't say he didn't. I said you didn't invoke the law, so too bad. The Geneva Convention dealt with this a few years ago.[/quote]You do realize that its a parody right? Not an actual rule or law... But we are done, if we can get back to topic please, which I am done with.

[Winchester]

[quote name='Mr.CatholicCat' timestamp='1305398447' post='2241448']
Good imagination.You do realize that its a parody right? Not an actual rule or law... But we are done, if we can get back to topic please, which I am done with.
[/quote]
Godwin's Law was formalized in both UN Councils and the Geneva Convention. The Warsaw Pact countries are still in debate. Somalian Pirates use a a variant based upon Esteemed Warlord M'fwne Tagulu.

Your huffing means less when you come back, like this.

Edited May 14, 2011 by Winchester

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1305397338' post='2241430']
the limit on taxation? i can't give a number since i have never added up how much it costs to do things.

the government has every right to take money from its people to provide a military for its protection. the military is there in case other entire countries want to do us harm. without a combined militray force Amercia would be easily defeatable. if america had not military in place to protect its people then china could come in and destroy america quite easily.

the government also had the responsibility to its citizen to provide for them the chance at life, liberty and the pursut of happiness. well some people without government assistance would be unable to even have a chance at life. there are many people who without any kind of assistance would die rather quickly. the government has a responsibility to those people to provide them with the chance at life. yes, private charities help. although private charities are unable to help ALL people. this is where the government needs to step in. when someone requires assistance to survive and are unable to get the assistance, the government has every right to step in and give the person assiatnce to survive.

so i am a coward because the government takes money from you and i agree that its ok? so let me ask you, do you think the government has any right to take ANY amount of money from you? cause without any money from anyone, there is no government. show me a single government which can survive without money. who is going to work for them without ever getting paid?

the roads arguement is not assanine. if everything was privatized and there was no government intrusion and no government oversight, then someone, let's say an athiest or protestant, it doesn't matter. one of them buys the road out of a catholic church and charges anyone who wants to use the road to the church one million dollars. without government oversight or intrusion and everything being privatly owned whats to stop someone from doing this? do you not think the devil will use ways such as this to not allow people to attend the catholic church? do i think this will happen on every road? certainly not. although i thinks its illogical with how society is today that this wouldn't happen some places. this is why its a good thing the government owns the roads and has oversight and intrusion on some instances.
[/quote]

First, lets be lear,one does not have to have a standing armyto be secure, most of the history of the world states have not had standing armies.

Certianly one does not have to have a large standing army.

But I concede that the governments role is to protectthe citizenry from outside agression, that might require a levy of taxes, however, ina democratic system the authority comes fromthe people, and each individual has the right to reject the rule of the state ona personal level, if one is willing to forgo state services and protection then one has every right to withhold his taxes. He chooses to withdraw fromthe democratic compact. The democratic state only has the authority youhave chosen to give it. It does not even claim a different source of authority.

[havok579257]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305397743' post='2241437']
Actually, if they want to preserve infrastructure, they will have a difficult time because we are armed individually. No thanks to your party.



The government has the obligation to not deny people these things.


I said you lack the courage to take money from me yourself. I didn't say you were a coward. I didn't reject all taxation, but I do reject redistribution of wealth by government coercion.


The desire to actually make money will stop them. Again, there are privately owned roads and they do not operate in this manner. So yes, your idea is asinine. Is government immune to the influence of the Devil? Once again, you betray your blind trust of State authority.
[/quote]

if you don't reject all taxation, what kinds do you support? what is the government allowed to take from you and what are they allowed to use it for?

to my party? what party is that? if your talking republican and democrate party, i like niether party nor support either party. so inform me, what party is my party?

there desire to make money. i just demonstrated an instance where the goal is not money but other objectives. someone people don't care about making money. they care about doing evil things. this is a perfect example. someone or some group who is completely against the catholic church who wants to keep its members from attending mass.

the roads do not operate in that manner because of government intrusuion and oversight. without ANY government intrusion and oversight the roads would be able to be run any way the owner chooses.

the devil does work thru the state no doubt about it. never said it didn't. although that does not make anything the government does as wrong. just like it does not make everything privately owned right.

[havok579257]

[quote name='Don John of Austria' timestamp='1305398647' post='2241452']
First, lets be lear,one does not have to have a standing armyto be secure, most of the history of the world states have not had standing armies.

Certianly one does not have to have a large standing army.

But I concede that the governments role is to protectthe citizenry from outside agression, that might require a levy of taxes, however, ina democratic system the authority comes fromthe people, and each individual has the right to reject the rule of the state ona personal level, if one is willing to forgo state services and protection then one has every right to withhold his taxes. He chooses to withdraw fromthe democratic compact. The democratic state only has the authority youhave chosen to give it. It does not even claim a different source of authority.
[/quote]


but in this instance when another country attacks the entire united states and the government protects the citizens as a whole, how does that work. do they tell china, hey you can bomb mike johnsons house in iowa and that's ok because we don't care about him? i would say if the person does not want government protection and don't want to pay taxes for it, move to another country. the government has a responsibility to protect its citizens and its land. it can not protect some citizens and some land from an outside force. it has to protect all or none.

[Winchester]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1305399232' post='2241457']
if you don't reject all taxation, what kinds do you support? what is the government allowed to take from you and what are they allowed to use it for?

to my party? what party is that? if your talking republican and democrate party, i like niether party nor support either party. so inform me, what party is my party?

there desire to make money. i just demonstrated an instance where the goal is not money but other objectives. someone people don't care about making money. they care about doing evil things. this is a perfect example. someone or some group who is completely against the catholic church who wants to keep its members from attending mass.

the roads do not operate in that manner because of government intrusuion and oversight. without ANY government intrusion and oversight the roads would be able to be run any way the owner chooses.

the devil does work thru the state no doubt about it. never said it didn't. although that does not make anything the government does as wrong. just like it does not make everything privately owned right.
[/quote]
You are nearly flawlessly consistent with the Democrat platform. That's your party, whether you like it or not. The more you protest, the more you prove it to be true. It's like a Chinese finger trap. I will take the mess of liberty over the false assurance of government authority. You choose the opposite. The problem is, your choice affects me more than mine affects you.

[havok579257]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305399801' post='2241463']
You are nearly flawlessly consistent with the Democrat platform. That's your party, whether you like it or not. The more you protest, the more you prove it to be true. It's like a Chinese finger trap. I will take the mess of liberty over the false assurance of government authority. You choose the opposite. The problem is, your choice affects me more than mine affects you.
[/quote]


well since the democratic platform is for abortion, gay marriage, union's having unlimited power, please show me where i have ever supported any of these things. show me where i have gone against church teaching on matters of abortion and gay marriage. if all your going to do is throw out insults and lies to try and make yourself appear superior, then there's no point in even talking with you. if you want to actually talk without throwing out insults and lies, then we can talk. although if your going to claim i support a party which goes against church teaching on abortion and homosexual marriage without a shread of evidence, then i guess i am done with your childish antics.

i would never accuse you of supporting a party that is against church teaching because you are a catholic above all else. i am a catholic above all else and do not support a party which goes against church teachings on abortion and homosexual marriage. an apology would be nice, although i won't hold my breath.

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1305399463' post='2241459']
but in this instance when another country attacks the entire united states and the government protects the citizens as a whole, how does that work. do they tell china, hey you can bomb mike johnsons house in iowa and that's ok because we don't care about him? i would say if the person does not want government protection and don't want to pay taxes for it, move to another country. the government has a responsibility to protect its citizens and its land. it can not protect some citizens and some land from an outside force. it has to protect all or none.
[/quote]


Youmight say that, butthat is not how democracy works. If china attacks, the government must defend its citizens, it does not have to protect mike johnson, he might benifit from their defence but they are under no obligation to defend him, they don't ned to evacuate him,or beconcerned about his house or any of the things governments are obliged todo for their citizens.


Youmay ask, "well what happens if to many people don't want to submit to government authority?" Well then... The government collapses.

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1305400309' post='2241465']
well since the democratic platform is for abortion, gay marriage, union's having unlimited power, please show me where i have ever supported any of these things. show me where i have gone against church teaching on matters of abortion and gay marriage. if all your going to do is throw out insults and lies to try and make yourself appear superior, then there's no point in even talking with you. if you want to actually talk without throwing out insults and lies, then we can talk. although if your going to claim i support a party which goes against church teaching on abortion and homosexual marriage without a shread of evidence, then i guess i am done with your childish antics.

i would never accuse you of supporting a party that is against church teaching because you are a catholic above all else. i am a catholic above all else and do not support a party which goes against church teachings on abortion and homosexual marriage. an apology would be nice, although i won't hold my breath.
[/quote]



But havok,you acknowledge the virtually unlimited authority of the state, thus you acknowledge that they have the authority to manage these things as they see fit.

Personally I am opposed to state sanctioned gay marraige, becuase I am opposed to state sanctioned marriage. The state has no buisness inthe marriage contract at all, and should get out of it. I oppose allstate sanctioned marriage.

[Winchester]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1305400309' post='2241465']
well since the democratic platform is for abortion, gay marriage, union's having unlimited power, please show me where i have ever supported any of these things. show me where i have gone against church teaching on matters of abortion and gay marriage. if all your going to do is throw out insults and lies to try and make yourself appear superior, then there's no point in even talking with you. if you want to actually talk without throwing out insults and lies, then we can talk. although if your going to claim i support a party which goes against church teaching on abortion and homosexual marriage without a shread of evidence, then i guess i am done with your childish antics.

i would never accuse you of supporting a party that is against church teaching because you are a catholic above all else. i am a catholic above all else and do not support a party which goes against church teachings on abortion and homosexual marriage. an apology would be nice, although i won't hold my breath.
[/quote]
[img]http://www.jontanis.com/gallery/d/5039-1/trollface.jpg[/img]

[havok579257]

[quote name='Winchester' timestamp='1305400682' post='2241469']
[img]http://www.jontanis.com/gallery/d/5039-1/trollface.jpg[/img]
[/quote]


i guess i should never have expected a mature answer from you. i hoped, but that hope was in vain obviously.

[Don John of Austria]

What is my response? Chopped Liver?