Mr.Cat Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 [quote][url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religiosity_and_intelligence#Studies_comparing_religious_belief_and_I.Q"][b]Studies comparing religious belief and I.Q[/b][/url] In 2008, intelligence researcher Helmuth Nyborg examined whether IQ relates to denomination and income, using representative data from the National Longitudinal Study of Youth, which includes intelligence tests on a representative selection of white American youth, where they have also replied to questions about religious belief. His results, published in the scientific journal Intelligence demonstrated that on average, [u]Atheists scored 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasions[/u]. "I'm not saying that believing in God makes you dumber. My hypothesis is that people with a low intelligence are more easily drawn toward religions, which give answers that are certain, while people with a high intelligence are more skeptical," says the professor. Nyborg also co-authored a study with Richard Lynn, emeritus professor of psychology at the University of Ulster, which compared religious belief and average national IQs in 137 countries. The study analysed the issue from several viewpoints. Firstly, using data from a U.S. study of 6,825 adolescents, [u]the authors found that atheists scored 6 g-IQ points higher than those adhering to a religion[/u]. Secondly, the authors investigated the link between religiosity and intelligence on a country level. [u]Among the sample of 137 countries, only 23 (17%) had more than 20% of atheists, which constituted “virtually all... higher IQ countries.”[/u] The authors reported a correlation of 0.60 between atheism rates and level of intelligence, which is “highly statistically significant.” This portion of the study uses the same data set as Lynn's work IQ and the Wealth of Nations. Commenting on the study in The Daily Telegraph, Lynn said "Why should fewer academics believe in God than the general population? I believe it is simply a matter of the IQ. Academics have higher IQs than the general population. [u]Several Gallup poll studies of the general population have shown that those with higher IQs tend not to believe in God."[/u][/quote]When I studied sociology, a Catholic doctor of sociology said that higher income, social support, education, and intelligence tended yield less religiosity. From my casual experience with religious people... moreover radtrads, fundamentalists, extremists, dogmatists... I do notice this trend. Response? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 you gave those people, "radtrads, fundamentalists, extremists, dogmatists" IQ tests? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Cat Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share Posted May 2, 2011 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1304365569' post='2235882']you gave those people, "radtrads, fundamentalists, extremists, dogmatists" IQ tests?[/quote] "[i]casual experience[/i]" should clarify that for you. Just in case you didn't catch it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Are you sure you are in a postion to judge intelligence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Cat Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share Posted May 2, 2011 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1304365934' post='2235887']Are you sure you are in a postion to judge intelligence?[/quote]Why are you turning this discussion into a trolling personal attack or at the least strawman argument? You're not helping your case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Please don't assume the worst. I am simply stating how can you judge intelligence from 'casualness' and compare it to actual IQ data? Please don't attack me again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Cat Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share Posted May 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1304366146' post='2235892']Please don't assume the worst. I am simply stating how can you judge intelligence from 'casualness' and compare it to actual IQ data? Please don't attack me again.[/quote]Well out of every other expert, who did the studies, and did do the testing... Which was the topic. You choose to narrow down the person who isn't an expert, didn't do these studies, and didn't test anyone (not the topic)... but whom agreed from personal and casual experiences. To note, my experience is focusing on income, education, and social support. Something that can be casually observed. So that is either a strawman or a personal attack, you want me to assume the best, so I will say strawman. The accurateness of my personal and casual experiences has no bearing on the topic. Please return to topic, considering your question has been sufficiently answered. Edited May 2, 2011 by Mr.CatholicCat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 is 3.82 IQ points statistically significant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amppax Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 (edited) [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1304366510' post='2235898'] is 3.82 IQ points statistically significant? [/quote] Not even a little bit, unless he is talking about average number of standard deviation, which in that case, I would highly doubt the study, as a 3 standard deviation difference is like the difference between average (about 100) and what is considered genius (145) I would assume that they are not saying that the difference is that much, because then i would accuse them of some serious sampling errors. Edited May 2, 2011 by Amppax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1304366510' post='2235898'] is 3.82 IQ points statistically significant? [/quote] It would depend on the sample size, right? Also I'm not sure that an IQ score is necessarily an objective/unbiased measurement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 oh, well then... have fun with your windmills!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Cat Posted May 2, 2011 Author Share Posted May 2, 2011 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1304366510' post='2235898']is 3.82 IQ points statistically significant?[/quote]I suppose you don't notice a trend, but just so you are aware, it would be "5.89" since Catholicism is classified as a dogmatic religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amppax Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1304366621' post='2235900'] It would depend on the sample size, right? Also I'm not sure that an IQ score is necessarily an objective/unbiased measurement. [/quote] No it wouldn't depend on sample size, it depends on standard deviation, and the standard deviation for IQ is 15 points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amppax Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 Also there is an inherent flaw in this study. You are comparing apples and oranges. the number of religous people worldwide is exponentially greater then the number of atheists, thus there would obviously be a greater variety in the intelligence levels of religous people then that of atheists, a smaller, and therefore less variable group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincent Vega Posted May 2, 2011 Share Posted May 2, 2011 "'I'm not saying that believing in God makes you dumber. My hypothesis is that people with a low intelligence are more easily drawn toward religions, which give answers that are certain, while people with a high intelligence are more skeptical,' says the professor." I could buy that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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