I Really Don't Like My Old Parish

[OnlySunshine]

I went there for Mass this evening for the first time again in several months. I didn't care for the music and general layout of the 5pm Mass on Sundays. It seems as though the choir loves having the attention focused on them. Most parishes I visit don't continue the procession song after the priest ascends the altar and is just standing there, but the choir at my old parish seems to continue on for like 2 minutes. It really distracts from the whole Mass as the woman in charge of the choir sounds tone deaf and really shouldn't be singing (I hate to say it, but she does). Also, the music is totally different from what I'm used to. I'm not even sure if it's licit songs because instead of singing "Praise to you, Lord Jesus Christ, King of endless glory" before the Gospel, they sang something like "I'm listening to you, O Lord, plant your word down deep in me."

There was a kid shouting and making a bunch of noise during the first half of Mass and there were no ushers to control the situation. The father finally got up with the kid and went to the cry room, but it was too late for me since I missed most of the Homily. Such distractions are ridiculous and I don't know why parents sit there with noisy kids who keep yelling "NO! NO! NO!" and other things at the top of their lungs while the priest is preaching.

When I've been to that Mass in the past, all that usually bothered me was the music, but it's so much more. Not to mention that the Church itself is extremely ugly and looks like something out of the space age. I've never liked it because it is all brown brick on the inside with an ugly wooden altar, chairs, and lectern. That doesn't usually stop me from going there, though, because the pastor is my old spiritual director and I like his homilies. Unfortunately, it was the older parochial vicar that was presiding over the Mass and he's a little strange. I read somewhere that he was divorced before he became a priest, but nowhere did it say that he received an annulment or was widowed so I'm not entirely sure his ordination was legit. I really hate thinking that, but my mom and I wondered how he could become a priest.

I am very happy I go to a more traditional, orthodox Church (yes, it is legit, not one of those rad-trad parishes). The priest is in his 40s, but he was only recently ordained in 2008, so he is very orthodox. We also have ushers that direct parents to the nursery or cry room if they have small children. The music is entirely palatable (our choir director went to Catholic University for school to study music), though there are some Marty Haugen songs thrown in at times, but it's not that bad.

Please forgive my rant. I just had to get this out because I feel like my old Church has gone way downhill. I still go there for Confession and Perpetual Adoration since they are right down the street from me (and because my parish only has Adoration one day a week). But the Masses are sour. I know they are licit, but I just don't appreciate the music and the liturgy there as much since the distractions are incredibly high. Am I nuts for thinking this way? I received all my Sacraments of Initiation there and I hate that it's not the same anymore.

[MissScripture]

I've been home with my parents due to school stuff for the past 3 1/2 months, and I have been watching the parish I grew up in fall apart. So, on the one hand, I REALLY understand the frustration. It's hard and it hurts.

On the other hand, I challenge you to find things that are good about it. It's so easy to start on the path of negativity and just keep going (I know, cuz I do it A LOT!). But remember, no matter our personal feelings about how things should be done, and even despite things not being 100% how the Church says they should be, Jesus is truly present as long as it is a Catholic priest and the consecration is done correctly. I'm not excusing bad behavior and saying that abuses are okay, but I think it's really, really important to remember that Jesus is still present, even at Masses where abuses take place.

[WarriorForJesus]

[quote name='MaterMisericordiae' timestamp='1302481625' post='2227323']
I went there for Mass this evening for the first time again in several months. I didn't care for the music and general layout of the 5pm Mass on Sundays. It seems as though the choir loves having the attention focused on them. Most parishes I visit don't continue the procession song after the priest ascends the altar and is just standing there, but the choir at my old parish seems to continue on for like 2 minutes. It really distracts from the whole Mass as the woman in charge of the choir sounds tone deaf and really shouldn't be singing (I hate to say it, but she does). Also, the music is totally different from what I'm used to. I'm not even sure if it's licit songs because instead of singing "Praise to you, Lord Jesus Christ, King of endless glory" before the Gospel, they sang something like "I'm listening to you, O Lord, plant your word down deep in me."

There was a kid shouting and making a bunch of noise during the first half of Mass and there were no ushers to control the situation. The father finally got up with the kid and went to the cry room, but it was too late for me since I missed most of the Homily. Such distractions are ridiculous and I don't know why parents sit there with noisy kids who keep yelling "NO! NO! NO!" and other things at the top of their lungs while the priest is preaching.

When I've been to that Mass in the past, all that usually bothered me was the music, but it's so much more. Not to mention that the Church itself is extremely ugly and looks like something out of the space age. I've never liked it because it is all brown brick on the inside with an ugly wooden altar, chairs, and lectern. That doesn't usually stop me from going there, though, because the pastor is my old spiritual director and I like his homilies. Unfortunately, it was the older parochial vicar that was presiding over the Mass and he's a little strange. I read somewhere that he was divorced before he became a priest, but nowhere did it say that he received an annulment or was widowed so I'm not entirely sure his ordination was legit. I really hate thinking that, but my mom and I wondered how he could become a priest.

I am very happy I go to a more traditional, orthodox Church (yes, it is legit, not one of those rad-trad parishes). The priest is in his 40s, but he was only recently ordained in 2008, so he is very orthodox. We also have ushers that direct parents to the nursery or cry room if they have small children. The music is entirely palatable (our choir director went to Catholic University for school to study music), though there are some Marty Haugen songs thrown in at times, but it's not that bad.

Please forgive my rant. I just had to get this out because I feel like my old Church has gone way downhill. I still go there for Confession and Perpetual Adoration since they are right down the street from me (and because my parish only has Adoration one day a week). But the Masses are sour. I know they are licit, but I just don't appreciate the music and the liturgy there as much since the distractions are incredibly high. Am I nuts for thinking this way? I received all my Sacraments of Initiation there and I hate that it's not the same anymore.
[/quote]


[color="#800080"]No, you are not "nuts". I do not know anything about you, your age, your gender, your education, etc. I can handle crying babies, without a problem. I can handle a cantor who seems not to be able to carry a tune in a bucket, without a problem. I can go to Mass in a building that is as drab as anything without a problem. Why? Because I do not go to Mass with any preconceived ideas of who will be there, where I should sit in order to be away from those who have little children, nor do I notice how the church is decorated, for the most part.

I ONLY go to Mass because I know that Jesus is there. He is in the Eucharist. He is in the Tabernacle. He is in the people around me.

I do not go to Mass, or a particular church building because of how it affects ME. I go to Mass in order to worship God and partake in the greatest prayer there is on earth.

Janice[/color]

[OnlySunshine]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1302482334' post='2227330']
I've been home with my parents due to school stuff for the past 3 1/2 months, and I have been watching the parish I grew up in fall apart. So, on the one hand, I REALLY understand the frustration. It's hard and it hurts.

On the other hand, I challenge you to find things that are good about it. It's so easy to start on the path of negativity and just keep going (I know, cuz I do it A LOT!). But remember, no matter our personal feelings about how things should be done, and even despite things not being 100% how the Church says they should be, Jesus is truly present as long as it is a Catholic priest and the consecration is done correctly. I'm not excusing bad behavior and saying that abuses are okay, but I think it's really, really important to remember that Jesus is still present, even at Masses where abuses take place.
[/quote]


[quote name='WarriorForJesus' timestamp='1302483429' post='2227340']
[color="#800080"]No, you are not "nuts". I do not know anything about you, your age, your gender, your education, etc. I can handle crying babies, without a problem. I can handle a cantor who seems not to be able to carry a tune in a bucket, without a problem. I can go to Mass in a building that is as drab as anything without a problem. Why? Because I do not go to Mass with any preconceived ideas of who will be there, where I should sit in order to be away from those who have little children, nor do I notice how the church is decorated, for the most part.

I ONLY go to Mass because I know that Jesus is there. He is in the Eucharist. He is in the Tabernacle. He is in the people around me.

I do not go to Mass, or a particular church building because of how it affects ME. I go to Mass in order to worship God and partake in the greatest prayer there is on earth.

Janice[/color]
[/quote]

I know that Jesus is still in the Eucharist. I wouldn't go if I didn't believe that, but I have Attention Deficit Disorder and extra sensitivity to what other people would call "small annoyances." I think it's because I have depression or anxiety. Frankly, the only reason I went to that one particular Church is because it's the only Church around that offers Sunday Mass late in the evening. I couldn't sleep last night for some reason so I knew I wouldn't be able to handle my regular 11am Mass without feeling like an absolute zombie.

Sometimes I feel like I should shut my mouth and go with the flow, and normally I do, but tonight it really bothered me. Maybe it wasn't just all that was going on, but I wasn't able to pray or pay attention and I feel really bad about that. I even sit in the front row because I have trouble paying attention unless I can see the priest (ADD again). These are definitely things I need to work on. I do feel bad for saying such things about the Church, but, honestly, this is really how I feel. I do think that I will refrain from attending my old parish and continue attending my regular parish where I am registered as a member. I really feel at home there, anyway.

[OnlySunshine]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1302482334' post='2227330']
I've been home with my parents due to school stuff for the past 3 1/2 months, and I have been watching the parish I grew up in fall apart. So, on the one hand, I REALLY understand the frustration. It's hard and it hurts.

On the other hand, I challenge you to find things that are good about it. It's so easy to start on the path of negativity and just keep going (I know, cuz I do it A LOT!). But remember, no matter our personal feelings about how things should be done, and even despite things not being 100% how the Church says they should be, Jesus is truly present as long as it is a Catholic priest and the consecration is done correctly. I'm not excusing bad behavior and saying that [b]abuses are okay[/b], but I think it's really, really important to remember that Jesus is still present, even at Masses where abuses take place.
[/quote]

I'm careful not to call them abuses, though. I'm no great scholar or anything, so I have no idea if they truly are abuses or not. It's just not my personal preference in what goes on there. It may be perfectly OK and approved by our Bishop, but I prefer better music and liturgy. I will still go to that Church if I absolutely have to because it is still Catholic (in case of an emergency or a day like today when I was feeling terrible this morning).

Please forgive me if anything I said is out of line. I am trying to be a faithful follower of the Pope and the local ordinary and I would hate it if anything I said was against the rules. I am just a miserable sinner who knows no better.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='MaterMisericordiae' timestamp='1302489351' post='2227375']
I'm careful not to call them abuses, though. I'm no great scholar or anything, so I have no idea if they truly are abuses or not. It's just not my personal preference in what goes on there. It may be perfectly OK and approved by our Bishop, but I prefer better music and liturgy. I will still go to that Church if I absolutely have to because it is still Catholic (in case of an emergency or a day like today when I was feeling terrible this morning).

Please forgive me if anything I said is out of line. I am trying to be a faithful follower of the Pope and the local ordinary and I would hate it if anything I said was against the rules. I am just a miserable sinner who knows no better.
[/quote]
Well, I was mostly just trying to point out the importance of finding something positive about it, regardless of if what you don't like are abuses or not. (I just didn't want someone else to come in and think I was saying, "well, abuses are okay, because Jesus is there.") I know from experience how easy it is to start down the path of negativity and pick apart every little thing I don't like and forget that there is some GOOD there, too. I kind of got hit with what my sister refers to as "a holy 2x4" a while back in regards to everything at my parents' parish and looking at it in not such a negative light. Yeah, a lot of bad stuff is happening, but that doesn't make everything completely bad. So, I give myself the challenge of finding something good amongst everything, too.

About the only thing other than going to far with general negativity that I would say you should be careful about, is the comment about the priest being divorced. In situations like that, it's often best to give the benefit of the doubt, as we don't usually know the whole story (and often times it's really none of our business anyway).

[havok579257]

practice patience and humility. our savior is the perfect example.

[Maggyie]

I know it's hard when the Mass isn't "beautiful" according to the world's standards. But try not to be too picky. So it's an ugly church - well, it costs money to do updates and sometimes when the collection is down like most have been the last few years, getting a fancy new lectern and altar is not the priority. The priority is paying the staff and not laying anybody off. The really nice materials (marble etc) are very expensive.

I would also try to avoid gossiping about the priest and his status. I mean it's very rare for a priest to be invalidly ordained (they're very... careful about that). The most likely situation is that the priest is both validly and licitly ordained, and if so he should be respected and it's not a good thing to be whispering with family members about him.

Screaming kids, yes, they are annoying, and it would be great if parents could get them out sooner, but sometimes I think Mom or Dad are hoping "just one more second and she'll shut up and be quiet as a lamb." Kids can go from screaming to silent in a matter of moments. It stinks to haul them up and down and all around when by the time you get to the cry room they're quiet. I knew of a bishop once who would always say when a baby cried during his Masses, "don't be embarassed, mom and dad. That's a beautiful noise. Too many little voices have been considered inconvenient or a potential annoyance and silenced in the abortion mills. That's the future of the church right there." Which if you look at it from that perspective makes it easier to bear.

I'm sure you know all this, you just needed to express yourself! It's ok to have liturgical/musical/social preferences. It can be frustrating when it's not done your way but just focus on Jesus who is there!

Edited April 11, 2011 by Maggie

[havok579257]

[quote name='MaterMisericordiae' timestamp='1302489351' post='2227375']
I'm careful not to call them abuses, though. I'm no great scholar or anything, so I have no idea if they truly are abuses or not. It's just not my personal preference in what goes on there. It may be perfectly OK and approved by our Bishop, but I prefer better music and liturgy. I will still go to that Church if I absolutely have to because it is still Catholic (in case of an emergency or a day like today when I was feeling terrible this morning).

Please forgive me if anything I said is out of line. I am trying to be a faithful follower of the Pope and the local ordinary and I would hate it if anything I said was against the rules. I am just a miserable sinner who knows no better.
[/quote]


unless you KNOW the priest was divorced before without an annulment and is not properly ordained, you are gossiping which is a sin. you are also spreading scandel to the priest. unless you know facts, best not to say anything. if you do know the facts, write a letter to your bishop.

[Lil Red]

could you somehow ask this priest his vocation story?

[Luigi]

Everybody sits through some Masses they don't like. As you said, it might be the churhc/musicians/screaming Mimis, or it could be that you just weren't in your praying groove. And that's the case for all of us. The screaming Mimis are my pet peeve - I know exactly how I'd handle it if they were my kids... but they're not. So I bite my tongue and think to myself, "Suffer the little children..." It's not what Jesus meant when He said it, but it gets me through.

On a side note: The bit about singing the whole processional song. That's one valid liturgical approach. The idea is that the song expresses praise (or thanks, or some other worthwhile sentiments) - it has value in and of itself - it's a sung prayer - it's not just a pleasant musical accompaniment for the procession - in that case, why would you cut it off just because the priest has arrived at the altar? - go ahead and finish the sung prayer. On the other hand, if the prayer is sung lousily....

[OnlySunshine]

[quote name='havok579257' timestamp='1302491075' post='2227385']
unless you KNOW the priest was divorced before without an annulment and is not properly ordained, you are gossiping which is a sin. you are also spreading scandel to the priest. unless you know facts, best not to say anything. if you do know the facts, write a letter to your bishop.
[/quote]

Please don't say something like this. I am not gossiping. My mom and I both knew his vocation story as it was in one of the diocesan magazines before his ordination. It's says right in the magazine that he was married for quite a number of years and had a family and was divorced. It made me confused because it did not mention whether or not he had an annulment. It may be none of my business, and that's ok. But when the diocese chooses to print it, then it can cause confusion, as it did for me. I'm not going to write a letter to my bishop because of this, either, because the facts could have been omitted accidentally.

[OnlySunshine]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1302489939' post='2227377']
Well, I was mostly just trying to point out the importance of finding something positive about it, regardless of if what you don't like are abuses or not. (I just didn't want someone else to come in and think I was saying, "well, abuses are okay, because Jesus is there.") I know from experience how easy it is to start down the path of negativity and pick apart every little thing I don't like and forget that there is some GOOD there, too. I kind of got hit with what my sister refers to as "a holy 2x4" a while back in regards to everything at my parents' parish and looking at it in not such a negative light. Yeah, a lot of bad stuff is happening, but that doesn't make everything completely bad. So, I give myself the challenge of finding something good amongst everything, too.

About the only thing other than going to far with general negativity that I would say you should be careful about, is the comment about the priest being divorced. In situations like that, it's often best to give the benefit of the doubt, as we don't usually know the whole story (and often times it's really none of our business anyway).
[/quote]

Ok, I just didn't understand what you were saying. I'm sorry. You do have a valid point.


[quote name='Maggie' timestamp='1302490746' post='2227383']
I know it's hard when the Mass isn't "beautiful" according to the world's standards. But try not to be too picky. So it's an ugly church - well, it costs money to do updates and sometimes when the collection is down like most have been the last few years, getting a fancy new lectern and altar is not the priority. The priority is paying the staff and not laying anybody off. The really nice materials (marble etc) are very expensive.

I would also try to avoid gossiping about the priest and his status. I mean it's very rare for a priest to be invalidly ordained (they're very... careful about that). The most likely situation is that the priest is both validly and licitly ordained, and if so he should be respected and it's not a good thing to be whispering with family members about him.

Screaming kids, yes, they are annoying, and it would be great if parents could get them out sooner, but sometimes I think Mom or Dad are hoping "just one more second and she'll shut up and be quiet as a lamb." Kids can go from screaming to silent in a matter of moments. It stinks to haul them up and down and all around when by the time you get to the cry room they're quiet. I knew of a bishop once who would always say when a baby cried during his Masses, "don't be embarassed, mom and dad. That's a beautiful noise. Too many little voices have been considered inconvenient or a potential annoyance and silenced in the abortion mills. That's the future of the church right there." Which if you look at it from that perspective makes it easier to bear.

I'm sure you know all this, you just needed to express yourself! It's ok to have liturgical/musical/social preferences. It can be frustrating when it's not done your way but just focus on Jesus who is there!
[/quote]

I never thought of it like that. I don't think I've been feeling well lately for some reason. It's probably the stress of the end of the semester and me thinking of all that needs to be done before then. I've been on a terrible sleep schedule because of insomnia and that's probably why it got on my nerves so bad. If it had been a different situation, I probably would have been able to tune it out and focus anyway. Who knows?

[quote name='Luigi' timestamp='1302491937' post='2227389']
Everybody sits through some Masses they don't like. As you said, it might be the churhc/musicians/screaming Mimis, or it could be that you just weren't in your praying groove. And that's the case for all of us. The screaming Mimis are my pet peeve - I know exactly how I'd handle it if they were my kids... but they're not. So I bite my tongue and think to myself, "Suffer the little children..." It's not what Jesus meant when He said it, but it gets me through.

On a side note: The bit about singing the whole processional song. That's one valid liturgical approach. The idea is that the song expresses praise (or thanks, or some other worthwhile sentiments) - it has value in and of itself - it's a sung prayer - it's not just a pleasant musical accompaniment for the procession - in that case, why would you cut it off just because the priest has arrived at the altar? - go ahead and finish the sung prayer. On the other hand, if the prayer is sung lousily....
[/quote]

You're right. I restrained myself. My perturbed self was wanting me to get up and walk out because I was getting so annoyed from lack of sleep, but I didn't because I didn't want to be disrespectful to the Lord. I think we all have bad days and this was definitely one of mine. I had a bad day yesterday because I had an argument with my mom, so I spent most of the day in my room, alone.

I've definitely got a lot to work on. Like I said previously, I am a sinner, but I'm trying to become a saint and sometimes I fall. Lord forgive me if I was disrespectful.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='MaterMisericordiae' timestamp='1302493209' post='2227400']
Ok, I just didn't understand what you were saying. I'm sorry. You do have a valid point.
[/quote]

No problem. I think in the first post, I was focusing so much on making sure I wasn't misinterpreted that I didn't really make myself clear. Kind of ironic, actually.

[OnlySunshine]

[quote name='MissScripture' timestamp='1302493653' post='2227405']
No problem. I think in the first post, I was focusing so much on making sure I wasn't misinterpreted that I didn't really make myself clear. Kind of ironic, actually.
[/quote]

Yeah, part of me wishes I had never posted this topic in the first place because it does sound a little ridiculous, but I needed to vent. I will always love my old parish because I have so many memories there. I know things usually change, but I am just not used to it at all especially since I've been going to a different Church since my reversion after my family moved to that parish. I really love our current pastor. He has given me so much guidance and support in my discernment. July will mark his first full year being our pastor after our previous one retired. He is amazing.