Lt. Gen. John Kelly "u.s. Largely Unaware Of Sacrifice"

[Semper Catholic]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/01/AR2011030106355.html?hpid=artslot

[quote] Kelly is the most senior U.S. military officer to lose a son or daughter in [url="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/world/countries/iraq.html?nav=el"]Iraq[/url] or Afghanistan. He was giving voice to a growing concern among soldiers and Marines: The American public is largely unaware of the price its military pays to fight the United States' distant conflicts. Less than 1 percent of the population serves in uniform at a time when the country is engaged in one of the longest periods of sustained combat in its history.

President Obama devoted only six sentences to the war in Afghanistan in his [url="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/politics/2011-state-of-the-union/index.html"]State of the Union[/url] address in January. The 25-second standing ovation that lawmakers lavished on the troops lasted almost as long as the president's war remarks.

Kelly has largely shunned public attention since his speech and his son's death. He discussed his speech and his son to provide insight into the lives and the burdens of military families.

[/quote]

[Semper Catholic]

Meant to put this in the news section

[Lil Red]

[quote name='Semper Catholic' timestamp='1299104139' post='2217276']
Meant to put this in the news section
[/quote]
gotcha covered.

[Semper Catholic]

[quote name='Lil Red' timestamp='1299104424' post='2217282']
gotcha covered.
[/quote]
gracias

[Sternhauser]

A sacrifice is only as noble as the cause for which it is actually made. Crooked politicians are deciding what cause that actually is, despite the best intentions of the actors. The cause is not freedom. Or security.

~Sternhauser

[Semper Catholic]

Bringing freedom to God's children is not noble?

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Semper Catholic' timestamp='1299106170' post='2217293']
Bringing freedom to God's children is not noble?
[/quote]

[quote]A sacrifice is only as noble as the cause for which it is actually made. Crooked politicians are deciding what cause that actually is, despite the best intentions of the actors. The cause is not freedom. Or security. [/quote]

~Sternhauser

Edited March 2, 2011 by Sternhauser

[Ed Normile]

[quote name='Sternhauser' timestamp='1299106588' post='2217296']
~Sternhauser
[/quote]


[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?app=forums&module=forums&section=findpost&pid=2217293"][img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_images/baisik/snapback.png[/img][/url]Semper Catholic, on 02 March 2011 - 05:49 PM, said:

[b][i]Bringing freedom to God's children is not noble?
[/i][/b]

Quote

[b]A sacrifice is only as noble as the cause for which it is actually made. Crooked politicians are deciding what cause that actually is, despite the best intentions of the actors. The cause is not freedom. Or security.
[/b]
Yeah the cause is actually BOTH freedom and security. Not only for the United States, also for Afghanistan as well as Israel. Afghanistan is now and has been not only a harbor for terrorists but also a staging and training ground for their activities. The Afghanis welcome our intervention there, we have re-opened schools and allowed food and supplies to reach the people, not be intercepted by the terrorists for their use. Bringing freedom and security to the children of God is indeed a noble cause, one that American troops have freely offered their lives, as heroes do, to ensure for these people, as well as our people.

ed

Edited March 3, 2011 by Ed Normile

[4588686]

This is one reason I support bringing back some form of the draft.

[sixpence]

*institute draft*

american people: whoa whoa whoa... hold on a sec.. do we Really need to be having this war???

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='sixpence' timestamp='1299163863' post='2217436']
*institute draft*

american people: whoa whoa whoa... hold on a sec.. do we Really need to be having this war???
[/quote]
I like the way you think.

[Lilllabettt]

I think in terms of strategy, the military should get its way. The military does not want the draft. They think it is is bad for morale and a waste of time to drag along whiny kids who don't want to be there. And you know they would whine. I had occasion to look it up recently: 400,000 dead soldiers in 4 years during WWII. 100,000 death toll every year. Would we tolerate that nowadays? Or would we have sued for peace with Hitler?

The Israelis have a mandatory year of service after high school ... but the reason that works over there is their culture demands it as something upstanding men and women must do.

[4588686]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' timestamp='1299175699' post='2217495']
I think in terms of strategy, the military should get its way. The military does not want the draft. They think it is is bad for morale and a waste of time to drag along whiny kids who don't want to be there. And you know they would whine. I had occasion to look it up recently: 400,000 dead soldiers in 4 years during WWII. 100,000 death toll every year. Would we tolerate that nowadays? Or would we have sued for peace with Hitler?

The Israelis have a mandatory year of service after high school ... but the reason that works over there is their culture demands it as something upstanding men and women must do.
[/quote]

I agree. I think American culture should demand it too. It is obnoxious to head pundits talking about how 'exhausted' Americans are by ten years of war. As though the wars have any impact on my or any other civilians life. Upwards of 90% of the country has absolutely no right to complain of being 'tired' of the wars. I that that is appalling.

I agree with you that the draft that previously existed should not be reinstituted however I think that there could be other models that work. Like perhaps the one in Germany.

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Ed Normile' timestamp='1299125638' post='2217373']
[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?app=forums&module=forums&section=findpost&pid=2217293"][img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_images/baisik/snapback.png[/img][/url]Semper Catholic, on 02 March 2011 - 05:49 PM, said:

[b][i]Bringing freedom to God's children is not noble?
[/i][/b]

Quote

[b]A sacrifice is only as noble as the cause for which it is actually made. Crooked politicians are deciding what cause that actually is, despite the best intentions of the actors. The cause is not freedom. Or security.
[/b]
Yeah the cause is actually BOTH freedom and security. Not only for the United States, also for Afghanistan as well as Israel. Afghanistan is now and has been not only a harbor for terrorists but also a staging and training ground for their activities. The Afghanis welcome our intervention there, we have re-opened schools and allowed food and supplies to reach the people, not be intercepted by the terrorists for their use. Bringing freedom and security to the children of God is indeed a noble cause, one that American troops have freely offered their lives, as heroes do, to ensure for these people, as well as our people.

ed
[/quote]

Ed, every soldier in every war, on every side, in the history of the world, has bravely and selflessly offered his life for the freedom of his people, didn't you know?


Oh, Göring[i] [/i]said it so well. Why don't people listen? The man didn't have anything to lose while sitting in his prison cell at Nuremberg.

[i]Göring: [/i]"Why, of course, the people don't want war. Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best that he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece. Naturally, the common people don't want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship."
[i]
Gilbert[/i]: "There is one difference. In a democracy, the people have some say in the matter through their elected representatives, and in the United States only Congress can declare wars."
[i]
Göring[/i]: "Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

This idiotic world is worthy of, ready and overdue for WWIII. Everyone in every country will salivate to line up for a chance to die for only noblest reasons, all over again.

~Sternhauser

Edited March 3, 2011 by Sternhauser

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='sixpence' timestamp='1299163863' post='2217436']
*institute draft*

american people: whoa whoa whoa... hold on a sec.. do we Really need to be having this war???
[/quote]

No, no. You've got to have every congressman and senator fight at least two tours in the hot zone in any war they declare (or don't bother declaring.) And their sons and daughters over the age of 15.

~Sternhauser