On Reading Wikileaks...

[Anastasia13]

I'm curious about the site.

[Mark of the Cross]

[quote name='Light and Truth' timestamp='1297645652' post='2212085']
I'm curious about the site.
[/quote]

I think the poll needs a few more options. I have not seen anything other than the short video 'collateral murder' so I cannot say if everything that Wikileaks exposes is good to do. There may be things that put innocent people in danger or threaten the security of the free world. But having served in the military during the Vietnam war I know such occurrences do happen, as well as rape and other abuses of civilians. It is a Christian duty to expose such events and to try to bring to justice perpetrators of such hideous crimes, as well as to pray for them. I certainly take pity on the soldiers and those who attempt to cover-up their crimes. The day of judgement will be a very miserable one for them.

[Anastasia13]

[quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1297980982' post='2213400']
I think the poll needs a few more options. I have not seen anything other than the short video 'collateral murder' so I cannot say if everything that Wikileaks exposes is good to do. There may be things that put innocent people in danger or threaten the security of the free world. But having served in the military during the Vietnam war I know such occurrences do happen, as well as rape and other abuses of civilians. It is a Christian duty to expose such events and to try to bring to justice perpetrators of such hideous crimes, as well as to pray for them. I certainly take pity on the soldiers and those who attempt to cover-up their crimes. The day of judgement will be a very miserable one for them.
[/quote]

Other-Please explain below
I figured there would be more than I would be able to think of.

Wikileaks takes secret info and publishes it online. This includes the secret writings of the church of Scientology as well as gov secrets. Gov secrets include US is monitoring corruption in Bulgaria, some dictator-guy has new arm candy, and various Afghan and/or Iraq war journals. The info on corrupt governments led to a revolution in Tunisia and then Egypt.

In the US, it is illegal for gov officials without security clearance to read classified documents. Some of these US documents are still considered classified, even though they have been somehow leaked. I have not read anything about us regulars reading wikileaks being illegal.

Wikileaks is defended as revealing corruption, using freedom needed for all press, and the US first amendment rights. It has been criticized for undermining diplomacy and for endangering lives of operatives. They (Wikileaks) claim to have a process of checking information for accuracy and security. To my knowledge, Wikileaks, while not as safe for the lives of some others, has not been inaccurate. There is a youtube video where a guy who used to be a fan of Wikileaks but then discovered that Wikileaks had been bought off from revealing anything negative about Israel. As was pointed out on Colbert's interview with founder Julian Assange, the 'collateral murder' part of the video info that became a more well-known of part of their publication was editorial, not just data. By and large though, my non-expert understanding of Wikileaks is that it publishes data, pure data, not analysis or commentary. On the other hand, I also found out from that Colbert interview and some other source that Wikileaks promises to the leaker (anonymity at least to the extent they are responsible for and that they will try for) the maximum political impact of the leaks that are given.

[Anastasia13]

Being listed by the dept. of defense or whoever is involved in the patriot act stuff doesn't worry you?

Would your answers change if you were to want to work for the gov at some point?

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Light and Truth' timestamp='1298199345' post='2214102']
Being listed by the dept. of defense or whoever is involved in the patriot act stuff doesn't worry you?

Would your answers change if you were to want to work for the gov at some point?
[/quote]
Do you think that the US is at the point where you're running the risk of being imprisoned just for reading the truth? If that's the case, then who's the bad guy?

[Catherine Therese]

I can honestly say I have absolutely no inclination to check out wikileaks, and I never have felt inclined to look at it.

Even when all the media madness was going on a little before Christmas, I couldn't think of anything less interesting. In fact, there was such a wikileaks saturation in the media that I felt like turning the radio off all the time!

[Mark of the Cross]

If these questions are aimed at me, my answers are:-
[quote name='Light and Truth' timestamp='1298199345' post='2214102']
Being listed by the dept. of defense or whoever is involved in the patriot act stuff doesn't worry you?
[/quote]
I had a look for the Wikileaks site once out of curiosity. At that time it was shut down or blocked. I was a bit annoyed at the possibility that my government may be censoring me, but then I can't be sure that I was stopped here. After reading this thread I decided to have another look since I had already seen part of 'collateral murder' on TV and wanted to see the full thing in detail without the hype. It was interesting that shortly after, my internet went off line! Could be and most likely was a mere 1 in a million coincidence. But to get to the question, firstly I'm an Australian, so I don't think your question applies to me. And in any event I couldn't care less, 'cause only the guilty need worry and paranoia is not one of my issues.
[quote]Would your answers change if you were to want to work for the gov at some point?
[/quote]
I spent 6 years in military service and 17 in telecommunications (at that time government owned) I see no reason why I would need to change my views. As far as witnessing human rights abuses I would feel it my Christian duty to take whatever action was deemed the most moral.
As far as human rights abuses and government corruption is concerned, Wikileaks would only be providing confirmation of what most intelligent people already know.
All Governments are corrupt to some degree. 'Stern' might be able to give some more info' on that subject regarding your government. .

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1298332114' post='2214520']
If these questions are aimed at me, my answers are:-

I had a look for the Wikileaks site once out of curiosity. At that time it was shut down or blocked. I was a bit annoyed at the possibility that my government may be censoring me, but then I can't be sure that I was stopped here. After reading this thread I decided to have another look since I had already seen part of 'collateral murder' on TV and wanted to see the full thing in detail without the hype. It was interesting that shortly after, my internet went off line! Could be and most likely was a mere 1 in a million coincidence. But to get to the question, firstly I'm an Australian, so I don't think your question applies to me. And in any event I couldn't care less, 'cause only the guilty need worry and paranoia is not one of my issues.

[/quote]
Wikileaks is often taken offline for whatever reasons, but luckily there are dozens of mirrors.

[Catholictothecore]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1298246996' post='2214249']
Do you think that the US is at the point where you're running the risk of being imprisoned just for reading the truth? If that's the case, then who's the bad guy?
[/quote]

Yes, there is the rub.

I do not read WikiLeaks. But that does not mean that I think, in all cases, the site is unjustified.

Our constitution grants us the right to freedom of speech, not because the government granted it to us, but because our early government was wise enough to acknowledge that human beings of all races, creeds, and colors had the right to say what they wanted to. To quote

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Almost every clause in this sentence, the 1st Amendment in the Constitutions Bill of Rights, is being violated. The Bill of Rights was not written as the first decrees of a government, who in its benevolence gave its citizens these rights. [b]It was written as a copy of the truths so self-evident they HAD to be written to stop future tyrants from ignoring them.[/b]

The truly scary thing is how far gone the people of this nation is. I cringe every time Obama talks of "granting the right to Health Care to the American people." [b]The government has neither the jurisdiction nor the compentancy to make, alter, or abolish a HUMAN RIGHT.[/b] That is because human beings are not their own masters, much as we'd like to think that we are. If we honestly think it is the governments own hands that our rights as human beings come from, I truly do fear for the fate of this nation.

And the worst part is, the people have denied themselves their rights as well. We have the right to petition the Government because of our grievances against them. The founding fathers knew that someday it would get out of hand, and[b] the people have the duty to keep their representatives in check[/b]. Voting isn't working. Rallies aren't working. We need something that will.

This is why I personally think the odds for the US are so bleak. The only hope we have is for a whole generation of politicians to come who do not care for themselves. We need citizens who will willingly sacrifice their time, money, and efforts to enter office when duly appointed, and who have the humility to exit office when duly appointed. [b]And the only way this is going to happen is for enough people to step forward and care that much[/b]. I include myself in that calling. When there is only one shot left to take, it must be taken. And sadly, it was what was supposed to be happening all along.

[Nihil Obstat]

It's so true. It really sets me on edge when people talk about granting rights. It's not just bad terminology anymore; people truly believe that a human right can be granted or taken away by governments.
Sometimes when starting the debate on freedom of speech, someone says to me "well we don't have the absolute right to freedom of speech like they do in the US." Bull. You better believe we have the right to freedom of speech. The Canadian government sure as hell can't take that away.

[Catholictothecore]

I hate politics. I really do. The way these people think they mess with our lives for their own agenda, or even worse, their sense of power. I actually am starting to feel like it's something I should be a part of, not because I want to, but because the world needs some one decent in the pool to choose from. I just keep praying, because what the world needs is about 1,000 people to step to the plate and BE the change the world needs. The answers do not lie in political games, in bills and amendments, or power struggles. It lies in the hearts of men and woman who are willing to be different, and to work to make a better world.

Sigh.

[kamiller42]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1298345857' post='2214553']
Wikileaks is often taken offline for whatever reasons, but luckily there are dozens of mirrors.
[/quote]
Do you condone the dissemination of illegally acquired material?

[Nihil Obstat]

Iunno.

[Catholictothecore]

The better question is whether or not those documents are doing any good.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Catholictothecore' timestamp='1298410276' post='2214678']
I hate politics. I really do. The way these people think they mess with our lives for their own agenda, or even worse, their sense of power. I actually am starting to feel like it's something I should be a part of, not because I want to, but because the world needs some one decent in the pool to choose from. I just keep praying, because what the world needs is about 1,000 people to step to the plate and BE the change the world needs. The answers do not lie in political games, in bills and amendments, or power struggles. It lies in the hearts of men and woman who are willing to be different, and to work to make a better world.

Sigh.
[/quote]
To be honest, I don't think becoming a part of it can help. To become a part of that system lends support to the system itself, which I'm starting to believe actually precludes essential change. Superficial change happens all the time, but the core is still rotten.