The Legalistation/decriminalisation Of Cannabis.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam' timestamp='1297032925' post='2209435']
It seems to me to be a non-issue. I look at it in a similar manner that I do alcohol, though in a very different way than most people use the analogy of the two substances. It is right that a government place restrictions on alcohol and make sure that alcohol not be consumed by certain parts of society (such as minors). It is just then that alcohol should be a controlled/monitored substance. However, part of this control will inherently be arbitrary and not mandated at a certain age by justice (such as placing the limit between 18 or 21. Such distinction is made with reasons but is ultimately a prudential decision on the part of rightful authority-such authority could include parents, a fact which many alcohol laws make allowances for and rightfully so). Therefore, since it is just to have alcohol laws, and assuming such laws were made by rightful authority and were promulgated, one should follow them. Similarly with cannabis, like tobacco and alcohol, it should be regulated. I can imagine a society that does in fact wish to have tobacco and alcohol and other such things and wishes to regulate them in a certain way and I can imagine other societies that choose to ban them as a form of regulation, a right that the people have in forming their society. It does not seem to me to be against justice that, when forming a society, the people can include or exclude what they want concerning such things deserving of regulation by authority. As such, it does not seem to me to be against justice for a people to decide to not allow cannabis but to allow such things as alcohol or tobacco, but rather follows the mores and preferences of the people as they create society.
[/quote]
Do you think the state government acts as the parents of the entire country? Parents have legitimate authority over their children by virtue of being parents. Do you grant that authority to your governing regime?
I don't.

My comments in [color="#000080"]blue[/color].
[quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1297035442' post='2209467']
Agreed! Why so touchy? We've had an argument over this before, so I'm not about to enter into that again. I don't like conflict especially with people I consider my friends. I was merely opening this up for discussion. I believe 2290 was your argument that's why I brought it up.
[color="#000080"]Glad we agree. I apologize if I sounded harsher than I intended.[/color]

Like I said there are grey area's. A priest, non Catholic (CofE) told me that the wine of Jesus day would have been non alcoholic and he would not use alcoholic wine for the Eucharist . I'm not interested enough to verify that, because I'm happy to use the alcoholic wine for it's therapeutic value. That is it reduces the risk of the spread of disease.
[color="#000080"]I am relatively sure that this is not the case, and someone who's studied the subject will be able to show you the arguments.[/color]

The use of tobacco also must include chewing it. I don't know anything about that and I'm not arguing against it. 2290 leaves open the possibility of this. This thread asks for [b]an opinion[/b], I'm giving mine. My opinion is that any kind of smoking is so dangerous to health and well being that it should not be [b]recommended for use[/b] at any level. I'm applying the line [i]'The use of drugs inflicts very grave damage on human health and life'[/i] as a qualifier of[b] My opinion[/b]. Nobody is compelled to take notice of me, in fact from what I have seen nobody will. I am not seducing anyone into something that could have a bad outcome for them. I just feel it a responsibility as does my (OZ) government and society to warn people that smoking of any substance is unwise.
[color="#000080"]I'm sure it does include chewing tobacco, but unless they specified chewing tobacco, I think we also must assume that smoked was intended. I agree that it's dangerous to the health, and I will never smoke. In fact it's especially dangerous to my health for a different reason. My point, as it was before, is that this is a choice left to the individual, not the government. Same with marijuana, IMO. It should be up to the individual to choose whether or not to consume, then to make the responsible choice and not consume in excess.[/color]


I didn't comment on that or intend too. It was part of the CCC, I didn't want to be guilty of the error of omission as far as the CCC is concerned.

It's sometimes difficult to discern what a given text means, but if I can't use the CCC as a [b]guide[/b], what do you propose I use, someone's opinion on a forum? When searching for Catholic truths I invariable ignore forums for the reason that they are hopelessly unreliable. In the past I was advised to stay away from forums but I'm a little recalcitrant. No malice intended.
[color="#000080"]I also recommend studying the older Church documents, as far back as you can get.[/color]
[/quote]

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1297035442' post='2209467']
Like I said there are grey area's. A priest, non Catholic (CofE) told me that the wine of Jesus day would have been non alcoholic and he would not use alcoholic wine for the Eucharist . I'm not interested enough to verify that, because I'm happy to use the alcoholic wine for it's therapeutic value. That is it reduces the risk of the spread of disease.
[/quote]

This event didn't happen too many days "after" Jesus's day:

"All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit enabled them. Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven. When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment, because each one heard their own language being spoken. Utterly amazed, they asked: "Aren't all these who are speaking Galileans? Then how is it that each of us hears them in our native language? Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome (both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs—we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!" Amazed and perplexed, they asked one another, "What does this mean?"

[b]Some, however, made fun of them and said, "They have had too much wine[/b]." Then Peter stood up with the Eleven, raised his voice and addressed the crowd: "Fellow Jews and all of you who live in Jerusalem, let me explain this to you; listen carefully to what I say. [b]These people are not drunk, as you suppose. It's only nine in the morning!"[/b]

It seems clear that wine was wine in Jesus's day. A lot of Old Testament folks got hammered, too.

11% alcohol or so is probably not enough to prevent the spread of disease. Even 91% Isopropyl can't kill everything off with a brief exposure.

~Sternhauser

Edited February 7, 2011 by Sternhauser

[Mark of the Cross]

[quote name='Sternhauser' timestamp='1297043141' post='2209519']
This event didn't happen too many days "after" Jesus's day:

"All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit enabled them. Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven. When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment, because each one heard their own language being spoken. Utterly amazed, they asked: "Aren't all these who are speaking Galileans? Then how is it that each of us hears them in our native language? Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome (both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs—we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!" Amazed and perplexed, they asked one another, "What does this mean?"

[b]Some, however, made fun of them and said, "They have had too much wine[/b]." Then Peter stood up with the Eleven, raised his voice and addressed the crowd: "Fellow Jews and all of you who live in Jerusalem, let me explain this to you; listen carefully to what I say. [b]These people are not drunk, as you suppose. It's only nine in the morning!"[/b]

It seems clear that wine was wine in Jesus's day. A lot of Old Testament folks got hammered, too.

11% alcohol or so is probably not enough to prevent the spread of disease. Even 91% Isopropyl can't kill everything off with a brief exposure.

~Sternhauser
[/quote]

I'm aware that that is most likely the case. In the wedding feast of Cana the heads scolded the servants for bringing out the best wine last. The theory was that you use the best first and then when the guests become intoxicated they don't notice that the later wine is inferior.
As regard to the spread of germs. Our priests announced during the flue episodes that the wine would not be used due to the risks and was resumed after the scare had passed. So I think the alcohol is considered more of a comforting thing than any substantial protection, just like using toilet blues. They also informed us that they had received opinions from experts who said that the chalice being gold plated would reduce the risk of infection. I couldn't overcome my disbelief at that but have always consumed any remaining blood at conclusion holding to the faith that I will only become ill if God allows it.

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1297045346' post='2209533']
I'm aware that that is most likely the case. In the wedding feast of Cana the heads scolded the servants for bringing out the best wine last. The theory was that you use the best first and then when the guests become intoxicated they don't notice that the later wine is inferior.[/quote]

I don't think Jesus would've made wine for already-drunk people.

[quote]As regard to the spread of germs. Our priests announced during the flu episodes that the wine would not be used due to the risks and was resumed after the scare had passed. So I think the alcohol is considered more of a comforting thing than any substantial protection, just like using toilet blues. They also informed us that they had received opinions from experts who said that the chalice being gold plated would reduce the risk of infection. I couldn't overcome my disbelief at that but have always consumed any remaining blood at conclusion holding to the faith that I will only become ill if God allows it.
[/quote]

Gold, no. Silver has antibiotic properties. I am of the opinion that the Precious Blood should not be distributed because of the risk of spilling It, not any risk to us. But I, too, believe that Jesus offers protection to those receiving the Bread of Life.

~Sternhauser

Edited February 7, 2011 by Sternhauser

[Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam]

[quote name='Ephrem Augustine' timestamp='1297034473' post='2209447']
There are people throughout california who would be ready to turn it into a private business. The thing is with that, at least you take marijuana out of the hands of criminals and into the hands of wealthy businessmen. For their part, I know drug cartels are making children into their assassins. So, if criminals couldn't get benefit for a drug like marijuana they would lose their power.

Decriminalized and legalized marijuana would still carry certain restrictions.
[/quote]

I live in California currently and there is only one problem with your scenario, the sale of marijuana is already mainly in the hands of business men here and it is fairly easy to get. Prop 19 failed here and the companies that already sell medical marijuana played a big role in its failing. They donated a great deal of money to anti-Prop 19 ads (Prop 19 would have legalized it in California). Selling marijuana is already a huge industry for these companies and they didn't want more competition in the market. It is not terribly hard to get one of the medical cards to be able to buy "medical" marijuana and I know of people who have the cards and who supply others with marijuana. The wealthy businessmen that you speak of are already making millions of dollars off of medicinal marijuana...and the drug cartels still exist. I think the problem will not be solved in switching the power from one group to another b/c cheap weed will still be in demand and the cartels will still provide it...in fact, legalizing may just make more users for the cartels to potentially sell to. They'll just undercut the "government approved" marijuana prices and people will still buy it from them, like they do now. Just something to think about.


[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1297042203' post='2209512']
Do you think the state government acts as the parents of the entire country? Parents have legitimate authority over their children by virtue of being parents. Do you grant that authority to your governing regime?
I don't.
[/quote]

In my little thought experiment concerning what would be possible in a just society with rightful government, I had a caveat about how rightful authority would defer to the rights of the parents on such issues and how there are examples of modern alcohol laws that do such a thing. However, perhaps I did not make the wording forceful enough to reflect this idea that when government crafts laws it should keep in mind its own role and the rights of parents concerning the raising of children. I apologize for not being clearer. That being said, when the people are able to make such decisions, I do think it is perfectly legitimate for the people of a society to choose to allow or not allow certain substances in their country.

**Edit**Spelling

Edited February 7, 2011 by Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam

[Mark of the Cross]

[quote name='Sternhauser' timestamp='1297045645' post='2209535']
I don't think Jesus would've made wine for already-drunk people.

[/quote]
[b]John 2:9-10[/b] [sup]9[/sup] and the master of the banquet tasted the water that had been turned into wine. He did not realize where it had come from, though the servants who had drawn the water knew. Then he called the bridegroom aside [sup]10[/sup] and said, “Everyone brings out the choice wine first and then the cheaper wine after [b]the guests have had too much to drink; but you have saved the best till now.” [/b]

[quote]Gold, no. Silver has antibiotic properties. [/quote]
Well that debunks the theory then. The chalice is gold plated on the inside.

[quote]I am of the opinion that the Precious Blood should not be distributed because of the risk of spilling It,[/quote]
Huh? What's it for then?

[Mark of the Cross]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1297042203' post='2209512']
My point, as it was before, is that this is a choice left to the individual, not the government. Same with marijuana, IMO. It should be up to the individual to choose whether or not to consume, then to make the responsible choice and not consume in excess.

Do you think the state government acts as the parents of the entire country?
[/quote]

Yes to a certain extent. Dangerous activities that impinge on the public are illegal and should be. Train surfing, swimming in dangerous area's, free climbing buildings or in parks to mention a couple, all put pressure on society funded assets such as rescue services, health systems and the danger to bystanders. Smoking cannabis in addition to the high risks of smoking tobacco places additional burdens on health resources and increases the risks to the public [url="http://www.drugs.health.gov.au/internet/drugs/publishing.nsf/content/marijuana"]see here[/url]. I voted for keeping it illegal but I do not see it as a criminal offence.

[southern california guy]

[quote name='Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam' timestamp='1297070399' post='2209609']
I live in California currently and there is only one problem with your scenario, the sale of marijuana is already mainly in the hands of business men here and it is fairly easy to get. Prop 19 failed here and the companies that already sell medical marijuana played a big role in its failing. They donated a great deal of money to anti-Prop 19 ads (Prop 19 would have legalized it in California). Selling marijuana is already a huge industry for these companies and they didn't want more competition in the market. It is not terribly hard to get one of the medical cards to be able to buy "medical" marijuana and I know of people who have the cards and who supply others with marijuana. The wealthy businessmen that you speak of are already making millions of dollars off of medicinal marijuana...and the drug cartels still exist. I think the problem will not be solved in switching the power from one group to another b/c cheap weed will still be in demand and the cartels will still provide it...in fact, legalizing may just make more users for the cartels to potentially sell to. They'll just undercut the "government approved" marijuana prices and people will still buy it from them, like they do now. Just something to think about.




In my little thought experiment concerning what would be possible in a just society with rightful government, I had a caveat about how rightful authority would defer to the rights of the parents on such issues and how there are examples of modern alcohol laws that do such a thing. However, perhaps I did not make the wording forceful enough to reflect this idea that when government crafts laws it should keep in mind its own role and the rights of parents concerning the raising of children. I apologize for not being clearer. That being said, when the people are able to make such decisions, I do think it is perfectly legitimate for the people of a society to choose to allow or not allow certain substances in their country.

**Edit**Spelling
[/quote]

Are you in southern California? I'm not aware of businessmen involved in the marijuana trade, but the Mexicans are into it in a big way. Did you hear Felipe Calderon arguing that if marijuana was legalized in California it would harm the poor Mexican farmers who are struggling to support their families. I personally know a number of Mexicans -- some here legally and some illegally -- who bring marijuana across the border and sell it. And I find it annoying that the newspapers and the media tend to twist things and argue that a Mexican -- who was deported because he was caught selling drugs -- was really deported because he was here illegally. Most, if not all, of the Mexicans who are deported are being deported because of drugs. And the main drug appears to be marijuana.

[Papist]

[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][b]Catechism of the Catholic Church[/b][/size][/font][/color]

[b][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]2211[/size][/font][/color][/b][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] The political community has a duty to honor the family, to assist it, and to ensure especially:[/size][/font][/color]

[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the freedom to establish a family, have children, and bring them up in keeping with the family's own moral and religious convictions;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the protection of the stability of the marriage bond and the institution of the family;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the freedom toprofess one's faith, to hand it on, and raise one's children in it, with thenecessary means and institutions;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the right to private property, to free enterprise, to obtain work and housing, and the right to emigrate;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]in keeping with the country's institutions, the right to medical care, assistance for the aged, and family benefits;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [u] [/u][/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][u]the protection of security and health, especially with respect to dangers like drugs, pornography, alcoholism, etc.;[/u][/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the freedom to form associations with other families and so to have representation before civilauthority.[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][b] [/b][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][b][font="Verdana"][size="2"]2291[/size][/font][/b] [font="Verdana"][size="2"]The[/size][/font] [i][font="Verdana"][size="2"]use of drugs[/size][/font][/i] [font="Verdana"][size="2"]inflicts very grave damage on human health and life. Their use, excepton strictly therapeutic grounds, is a grave offense. Clandestine production ofand trafficking in drugs are scandalous practices. They constitute directco-operation in evil, since they encourage people to practices gravely contraryto the moral law.[/size][/font][/size][/font][/color]

Edited February 7, 2011 by Papist

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1297073387' post='2209612']
Huh? What's it for then?
[/quote]
There's no reason the Precious Blood needs to be distributed to anyone. Only the priest need consume it. This is what happened before the 60s.

[Nihil Obstat]

Mine in [color="#000080"]blue[/color].

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1297088887' post='2209642']
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][b]Catechism of the Catholic Church[/b][/size][/font][/color]

[b][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]2211[/size][/font][/color][/b][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] The political community has a duty to honor the family, to assist it, and to ensure especially:[/size][/font][/color]

[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the freedom to establish a family, have children, and bring them up in keeping with the family's own moral and religious convictions;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#000080"]The State has failed at this. Funding of abortion and contraception is mutually exclusive with this ideal.[/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the protection of the stability of the marriage bond and the institution of the family;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#000080"]The State actively undermines this.[/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the freedom toprofess one's faith, to hand it on, and raise one's children in it, with thenecessary means and institutions;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#000080"]Done poorly, if at all.[/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the right to private property, to free enterprise, to obtain work and housing, and the right to emigrate;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#000080"]Getting iffier every day.[/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]in keeping with the country's institutions, the right to medical care, assistance for the aged, and family benefits;[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#000080"]The State tends to get in the way of this. If we have it, it is in spite of their intervention.[/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [u] [/u][/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][u]the protection of security and health, especially with respect to dangers like drugs, pornography, alcoholism, etc.;[/u][/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#000080"]See my post above RE: alcohol, caffeine.[/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"] [color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]- [/size][/font][/color][color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"]the freedom to form associations with other families and so to have representation before civilauthority.[/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#000080"]Intervention in relevant industries crowds out potential 'associations'.[/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][b] [/b][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#202020"][font="Verdana"][size="2"][b][font="Verdana"][size="2"]2291[/size][/font][/b] [font="Verdana"][size="2"]The[/size][/font] [i][font="Verdana"][size="2"]use of drugs[/size][/font][/i] [font="Verdana"][size="2"]inflicts very grave damage on human health and life. Their use, excepton strictly therapeutic grounds, is a grave offense. Clandestine production ofand trafficking in drugs are scandalous practices. They constitute directco-operation in evil, since they encourage people to practices gravely contraryto the moral law.[/size][/font][/size][/font][/color]
[color="#000080"]Already addressed.[/color]
[/quote]
In short, the state government fails at most, if not all of these. What moral authority does it truly have? None whatsoever.

[Papist]

[center][center][font="Arial"][size="3"][left][center]
[/center][/left][/size][/font][/center][/center]

Edited February 7, 2011 by Papist

[Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam]

[quote name='southern california guy' timestamp='1297084061' post='2209631']
Are you in southern California? I'm not aware of businessmen involved in the marijuana trade, but the Mexicans are into it in a big way. Did you hear Felipe Calderon arguing that if marijuana was legalized in California it would harm the poor Mexican farmers who are struggling to support their families. I personally know a number of Mexicans -- some here legally and some illegally -- who bring marijuana across the border and sell it. And I find it annoying that the newspapers and the media tend to twist things and argue that a Mexican -- who was deported because he was caught selling drugs -- was really deported because he was here illegally. Most, if not all, of the Mexicans who are deported are being deported because of drugs. And the main drug appears to be marijuana.
[/quote]

I'm in Berkeley and the businessmen I am talking about are not businessmen who happen to sell marijuana but rather the businesses that run the companies that sell marijuana to people with the medical cards for "medicinal" reasons. It is a multi-billion dollar industry and from what I understand the cards that allow one to be able to buy it are very easy to get.

I have also wondered about the negative effects that legalization would have on individual Mexicans and their families but if perhaps in the long run it might be better for the Mexican people since it would harm the drug lords that harm that country so much.

[Papist]

[font="Tahoma"][size="2"]"It is true that there is a distinct difference between the use of drugs and the use of alcohol: while a moderate use of the latter a sa drink does not offend moral principles, only its abuse can be condemned; instead, the use of drugs is always unlawful because it implies an unjustifiedand unreasonable renunciation of thinking, desiring and acting as a freeperson" (Dolentium Hominum, 19, Vll, 1992, n. 1).[/size][/font]

[font="Tahoma"] [/font][font="Tahoma"][size="2"]Pontifical Council for the Family[/size][/font]
[font="Tahoma"][size="2"]Should 'soft' drugs be legalized?[/size][/font]
[font="Tahoma"][size="2"]January 17, 1997[/size][/font]
[font="Tahoma"][size="2"][url="http://www.ewtn.com/library/CURIA/PCFDRUGS.HTM"]http://www.ewtn.com/...IA/PCFDRUGS.HTM[/url][/size][/font]

Edited February 7, 2011 by Papist

[ParadiseFound]

[quote name='Papist' timestamp='1297102641' post='2209700']
[font="Tahoma"][size="2"]"It is true that there is a distinct difference between the use of drugs and the use of alcohol[/size][/font][/quote]
As someone pointed out before, alcohol [b]is[/b] a drug.