Didacus Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 [quote name='JoyfulLife' timestamp='1296523368' post='2207255'] [snip] There was a story of a Saint that asked God to let a soul in Hell have an experience of Heaven and Jesus; it was granted and they couldn't bare it; they ended up begging to be put back in Hell. [/quote] That actually makes sense to me. Do you happen to recall any other details of the story? Anything that may be searched on the internet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatherineM Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 To quote one of my favorite books, "Of course it is happening inside your head,... but why on Earth should that mean that it is not real." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah147 Posted February 11, 2011 Share Posted February 11, 2011 [quote name='Didacus' timestamp='1297319817' post='2210890'] That actually makes sense to me. Do you happen to recall any other details of the story? Anything that may be searched on the internet? [/quote] I will have to ask the person that told me. I'll get back to you on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Maybe the people who had the near death experiences, weren't going to heaven. I have experienced my soul being united with Jesus and I was pretty sure I was on my way to heaven. I was very disappointed when I had to go back. I have seen many saints and also souls in purgatory, but they were not related to near death experiences, just supernatural ones. They were either just saying hi or asking for prayer. I do know that death, if you are not hellbound, is going to be so very amesome, even if one does go to purgatory. Even there, you are so much closer to God than we are here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah147 Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 [quote name='rhetoricfemme' timestamp='1296937799' post='2209064'] Scary, indeed! I wonder if even the hesitation at God asking you for your choice is the choice within itself. If God asks you if it'll be Him or your sins, and you have even take a second to think back and savor one last memory of that old life... That could very well be it. All the more reason to practice restraint here and now. [/quote] Good point and that makes me wonder, but that could even be small attachments that need purifying in Purgatory, I suppose. There is something I've been wondering tonight. It has to to with Saint Faustina's visions of Heaven, Hell and Purgatory. [quote] [i]"...I saw two roads. One was broad, covered with sand and flowers, [b]full of joy, music and all sorts of pleasures. [/b]People walked along it, [b]dancing and enjoying themselves. They reached the end without realizing it.[/b] And at the end of the road there was a horrible precipice; that is, the abyss of hell. [b]The souls fell blindly into it; as they walked, so they fell.[/b] And their number was so great that it was impossible to count them. And I saw the other road, or rather, a path, for it was narrow and strewn with thorns and rocks; and the people who walked along it had tears in their eyes, and all kinds of suffering befell them. Some fell down upon the rocks, but stood up immediately and went on. At the end of the road there was a magnificent garden filled with all sorts of happiness and all these souls entered there. At the very first instant they forgot all their sufferings"[/i] (Diary 153). [url="http://cloudoffire.blogspot.com/2009/03/visions-of-hell-purgatory-and-heaven.html"]http://cloudoffire.b...and-heaven.html[/url] [url="http://www.divinemercysunday.com/vision.htm"]http://www.divinemer....com/vision.htm[/url] [/quote] Now, people have to CHOOSE SIN OVER GOD, to go to Hell. The bolded parts confused me, because they seem happy, and to have been choosing good. It didn't seem conscious to them that they chose Hell. Ignorance reduces the severity of sin, but it doesn't look like it according to that passage. Explanations? Why did THOSE people go to Hell? What in their wills was choosing Hell? What in itself was choosing Hell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dairygirl4u2c Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 (edited) Edited February 13, 2011 by dairygirl4u2c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExCorde Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 [quote name='JoyfulLife' timestamp='1297562007' post='2211841'] Why did THOSE people go to Hell? What in their wills was choosing Hell? What in itself was choosing Hell? [/quote] Amazing questions! That's the sort of thing I was asking about on the topic [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=110909"][b]Why Are We So Distracted From God When We're Young?[/b][/url] which is essentially about how appearances may fool and satisfy us. Feel free to jump in! I'll reply to this here, from my very limited understanding of St. Faustina and these matters in general. In their wills these souls seem to have [b]desired the reward but not the sacrifice[/b]. In this sense they did not want to serve God, but themselves. I mean, they did not offer themselves. They weren't looking for Christ. They didn't seek the kingdom of God first... Our immediate experience isn't the eternal realities but the temporal ones. We can (here and now) understand how pleasures and appearances may temporarily attract us but they're only an introduction that anticipates the final joy of truth and love, replacing it with the illusion of immediate gratification. Perhaps this is most of what the saint was alluding to? It is a matter of religious integrity that we are not selfish about heaven. I find it quite disturbing when people take heaven for granted or simply believe out of fear of hell. It really does sadden me and I know it confuses many people who are turned away from God due to such confusions. God is love, God is love...! Joy accompanies love at the end of the road, not necessarily at the start; also, if we don't distinguish love from pleasure we fool ourselves in our relationship with others - these relationships are only as good as they pleasure us since [b]we were always separated from them without knowing it[/b]. The consequences in the end can be devastating. If we can relate this to eternal realities, then this is hell, to be so trapped in our desire (bent to serve ourselves) that we cannot bring ourselves to bathe in the light of salvation: no matter how glorious it really is, we're blind and filthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Wednesday Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 [quote name='JoyfulLife' timestamp='1297562007' post='2211841'] Good point and that makes me wonder, but that could even be small attachments that need purifying in Purgatory, I suppose. There is something I've been wondering tonight. It has to to with Saint Faustina's visions of Heaven, Hell and Purgatory. Now, people have to CHOOSE SIN OVER GOD, to go to Hell. The bolded parts confused me, because they seem happy, and to have been choosing good. It didn't seem conscious to them that they chose Hell. Ignorance reduces the severity of sin, but it doesn't look like it according to that passage. Explanations? Why did THOSE people go to Hell? What in their wills was choosing Hell? What in itself was choosing Hell? [/quote] Hard to say since she was only describing what she saw in passing, and didn't describe what was in their hearts. I always interpreted that passage that they weren't choosing good, but choosing an easy life with very little thought or care about God. If I had to guess, as blindness has been used as a metaphor for sin -- and in the case of someone going to hell, they persisted and chose to remain blind, and didn't care enough to change their lives. But deep down, they knew better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark of the Cross Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 [quote name='ExCorde' timestamp='1297618149' post='2211970'] Amazing questions! That's the sort of thing I was asking about on the topic [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=110909"][b]Why Are We So Distracted From God When We're Young?[/b][/url] which is essentially about how appearances may fool and satisfy us. Feel free to jump in! [/quote] Just to add a snippet. Cynics often ask why the Church is full of old people. Answer- people are always older at the end of a journey than they are at the beginning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didacus Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 [quote name='JoyfulLife' timestamp='1297463679' post='2211480'] I will have to ask the person that told me. I'll get back to you on that. [/quote] OK then. I'll just hang out around here awhile 'till you get back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah147 Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 lol Give me a few days. I've been forgetful, so you'll have to forgive me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExCorde Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 [quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1297634313' post='2212021'] Just to add a snippet. Cynics often ask why the Church is full of old people. Answer- people are always older at the end of a journey than they are at the beginning. [/quote] I relate to that Mark, but you could go say this on that thread and perhaps add a few things from your own experience! And we could talk more about that then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah147 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 [quote name='Didacus' timestamp='1297648130' post='2212102'] OK then. I'll just hang out around here awhile 'till you get back. [/quote] Well, I asked and got quite a lecture for me, you and everyone. All I can say is that people shouldn't get wrapped up in these sort of happenings (non-Church approved events). The book "Fire Within" by Fr. Dubay was recommended, as it answers things of this sort. The big concern is over people falling into [b]"error,"[/b] which can be worse than sin, and it isn't easily discernable. I'm still fairly new to Catholicism, and clearly I'm guilty of discussing Doctrine matters/events that haven't been yet Church-approved, even Saint stories; even Saints have been known to be wrong. So not everything coming from a Saint in their entire life is error-proof; just what they wrote or said that has been Church-approved thus far. Lord, help me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didacus Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Lets move on then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarah147 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 (edited) Ah, wadda ya gunna do? Fuggedaboutit. [img]http://www.freesmileyfacecentral.com/dan/gangster%20(4).gif[/img] Edited February 16, 2011 by JoyfulLife Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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