Steroids

[Guest]

If you lived somewhere where steroids were legal would it be a grave sin to use them if they were issued by a doctor and used correctly and not abused ? And the goal for using them would be a more muscular body. Thanks.

[Hinter dem Horizont]

Some people actually require steroids. Otherwise they'd collapse from weakness. And sometimes babies are given steroids after birth.

But, using it "legally" just to get more muscular is definitely a no to me. Just work out and use proteins. I work out every week and use protein powder mixed with water and I became more muscular within a few weeks.

[Guest]

Y[quote name='Hinter dem Horizont' timestamp='1295713925' post='2203046']
Some people actually require steroids. Otherwise they'd collapse from weakness. And sometimes babies are given steroids after birth.

But, using it "legally" just to get more muscular is definitely a no to me. Just work out and use proteins. I work out every week and use protein powder mixed with water and I became more muscular within a few weeks.
[/quote]
Ya I have never used them. I've built some respectable muscle naturally. I can build a lot more without them to. I think at my heigth my genetic limit for lean body mass without steroids is like 190.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' timestamp='1295712500' post='2203039']
If you lived somewhere where steroids were legal would it be a grave sin to use them if they were issued by a doctor and used correctly and not abused ? And the goal for using them would be a more muscular body. Thanks.
[/quote]
I used steroids legally and by prescription for about three months. Not using them in fact would have been irresponsible and dangerous. It had nothing to do with muscles or growth or energy. It was used to fight inflammation in my ileum, combined with an immunosuppressant which I am still taking.
So there is nothing inherent in taking steroids that is immoral.

If the goal was simply aesthetic, then one would likely be guilty of vanity, and since they are using drugs with potentially serious side effects, that could be considered abuse of their own body, similar (but not identical) to purposefully getting drunk.

[Guest]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1295721136' post='2203067']
I used steroids legally and by prescription for about three months. Not using them in fact would have been irresponsible and dangerous. It had nothing to do with muscles or growth or energy. It was used to fight inflammation in my ileum, combined with an immunosuppressant which I am still taking.
So there is nothing inherent in taking steroids that is immoral.

If the goal was simply aesthetic, then one would likely be guilty of vanity, and since they are using drugs with potentially serious side effects, that could be considered abuse of their own body, similar (but not identical) to purposefully getting drunk.
[/quote]
Sorry to hear about the illness. I hope you are doing well. What if you were taking them to have a better body for your wife. Would that still be considered vanity ?

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' timestamp='1295723177' post='2203082']
Sorry to hear about the illness. I hope you are doing well. What if you were taking them to have a better body for your wife. Would that still be considered vanity ?
[/quote]
I believe it would be. A body doesn't need steroids to look healthy and fit. You do need steroids to look like MIkolbe though:
[img]http://www.fastmusclebuilder.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/1man1-300x285.jpg[/img]

Vanity is the one point, but IMO the more important one is the physical harm you do to yourself. The effects of steroids are pretty well documented, and I think that using them for non-essential reasons boils down to self-harm.

(and yes, thanks, I'm doing much better now. The prednisone worked miracles.)

Edited January 22, 2011 by Nihil Obstat

[Guest]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1295723475' post='2203085']
I believe it would be. A body doesn't need steroids to look healthy and fit. You do need steroids to look like MIkolbe though:
[img]http://www.fastmusclebuilder.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/1man1-300x285.jpg[/img]

Vanity is the one point, but IMO the more important one is the physical harm you do to yourself. The effects of steroids are pretty well documented, and I think that using them for non-essential reasons boils down to self-harm.

(and yes, thanks, I'm doing much better now. The prednisone worked miracles.)
[/quote]
Greg valentino or whatever his name is, is an idiot. He clearly abused steroids. lol. I have read how bad steroids are and all that. And then I've also read stuff that says the government just uses that as scare tatitics. And if not abused and given by a doctor there is really no harm or risk. Sorta like all the anti marijuana stuff the govenment put out there. It was a bunch of lies. O and I'm glad you are doing well. Godbless.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' timestamp='1295724334' post='2203094']
Greg valentino or whatever his name is, is an idiot. He clearly abused steroids. lol. I have read how bad steroids are and all that. And then I've also read stuff that says the government just uses that as scare tatitics. And if not abused and given by a doctor there is really no harm or risk. Sorta like all the anti marijuana stuff the govenment put out there. It was a bunch of lies. O and I'm glad you are doing well. Godbless.
[/quote]
I agree with you on marijuana. I think it needs to be legalized. There's a case to be made about other drugs, I'm sure, but I don't want to get into that.
Obviously there is risk with any chemical that you take into your body. For instance, while I was on prednisone, if I had stopped cold turkey for longer than about a day, I would have ended up in the hospital due to a certain type of withdrawal. Pretty heavy stuff, which is why it can't be taken lightly.

[Guest]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1295724521' post='2203097']
I agree with you on marijuana. I think it needs to be legalized. There's a case to be made about other drugs, I'm sure, but I don't want to get into that.
Obviously there is risk with any chemical that you take into your body. For instance, while I was on prednisone, if I had stopped cold turkey for longer than about a day, I would have ended up in the hospital due to a certain type of withdrawal. Pretty heavy stuff, which is why it can't be taken lightly.
[/quote]
4 sure.

[StMichael]

Not a fan of steroids for body shaping, but you have stuff like Cenegenics which is hormone replacement therapy. If taking steroids is considered vanity, I would then have to ask isn't working out to look good fall into the same category?

And then you have Stallone, 65 years old, big supporter of HGH:

[img]http://kraran.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/sylvester-stallone-expendables-movie.jpg[/img]

[southern california guy]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1295721136' post='2203067']
I used steroids legally and by prescription for about three months. Not using them in fact would have been irresponsible and dangerous. It had nothing to do with muscles or growth or energy. It was used to fight inflammation in my ileum, combined with an immunosuppressant which I am still taking.
So there is nothing inherent in taking steroids that is immoral.

If the goal was simply aesthetic, then one would likely be guilty of vanity, and since they are using drugs with potentially serious side effects, that could be considered abuse of their own body, similar (but not identical) to purposefully getting drunk.
[/quote]

Aren't you talking about "steroids" like cortisone -- which is an anti-inflammatory? They're quite a bit different than anabolic "steroids". And they can be catabolic (Cause the muscle to break down rather than build up). Here's the definition from Wikipedia.

[b]A [color="#FF0000"][color="#FF0000"]steroid[/color][/color] is a type of organic compound that contains a specific arrangement of four cycloalkane rings that are joined to each other. Examples of steroids include the[color="#000080"] dietary fat cholesterol[/color], the sex hormones[color="#000080"] estradiol [/color]and [color="#000080"]testosterone[/color], and the anti-inflammatory drug [color="#000080"]dexamethasone[/color].

The core of steroids is composed of seventeen carbon atoms bonded together that take the form of four fused rings: three cyclohexane rings (designated as rings A, B, and C in the figure to the right) and one cyclopentane ring (the D ring). The steroids vary by the functional groups attached to this four ring core and by the oxidation state of the rings. Sterols are special forms of steroids, with a hydroxyl group at position-3 and a skeleton derived from cholestane.[1]

Hundreds of distinct steroids are found in plants, animals, and fungi. All steroids are made in cells either from the sterols lanosterol (animals and fungi) or from cycloartenol (plants). Both lanosterol and cycloartenol are derived from the cyclization of the triterpene squalene.[2]
[/b]


An important thing to remember about anabolic steroids is that they are hard on your liver, and can lead to heart attacks. Both things can shorten both the quality and length of your life.

I competed in powerlifting when I was younger and I knew people who took them -- plus I've read a great deal about them for the last twenty years. Let's just say that they do have side effects -- even when taken under a doctors supervision.

I've never taken any and you couldn't pay me to take them. However I bought some weights from a competitive, and natural, powerlifter up in Los Angeles. He told me that his dad -- who's in his eighties -- was having real physical problems, and his doctor suggested anabolic steroids. He told me that his had dad started taking a mild anabolic steroid and it had helped him incredibly.

As far as building muscle the things that really limit you are the amount of food you eat, and the amount of sleep you get (More sleep equals more testosterone. [b]People who do don't get much sleep have low testosterone levels[/b]).

And you need to eat as much good quality food as you can get yourself to eat. Yes you will get fat, but you will also gain strength and muscle size. Let's face it you're not going to stay lean and gain much muscle. Sorry it just doesn't work that way. The best you can do is to "bulk up" (Get fat and gain muscle) and then do a lot of cardio, cut your calories -- and try to lose the fat without losing too much muscle. If you stay lean you won't be able to increase your muscle and strength by much.

And the idea that lots of repetitions with low weight builds muscle is a bunch of nonsense. You've got to look at it from a realistic point of view -- your body is going to try and become[b] efficient[/b] to the stress it receives. Lots of repetitions with light weight may pump up the muscles but what you're doing is endurance exercise -- and large muscles are not efficient for endurance exercise. Lean muscles with predominantly slow twitch muscle cells are efficient for endurance. Lugging around extra weight is not. A larger muscle is like a larger rope. It is useful to move a bigger weight. To make the muscle bigger you have to force it to lift a bigger and bigger weight. Remember you're not shooting for endurance so you don't have to do a lot of sets and a lot of repetitions. You can train like a powerlifter and "pyramid" your sets -- a set of ten to warm up, a set or two work sets for five reps, and a really heavy weight for one to two reps. Powerlifters may not look as big as some bodybuilders, but that's partly because they're fatter.

After working out take a good electrolyte drink like "Recharge", and try to eat within 45 minutes of working out. You'll find your workout is also better if you eat something good beforehand -- but don't overdo it.

If you wonder if this sort of training will increase your chances of getting hurt, the answer is "It sure will!". But to really get strong you have to really force things.

I got myself up to almost 250 pounds -- at 6 feet 2 inches tall. Then I gave up and decided that I didn't really feel that good at that weight. I'm back down around 200 now.

Edited January 23, 2011 by southern california guy

[southern california guy]

[img]http://www.bodybuildingblog.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/syntholfreak-300x264.jpg[/img]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' timestamp='1295724334' post='2203094']
Greg valentino or whatever his name is, is an idiot. He clearly abused steroids. lol. I have read how bad steroids are and all that. And then I've also read stuff that says the government just uses that as scare tatitics. And if not abused and given by a doctor there is really no harm or risk. Sorta like all the anti marijuana stuff the govenment put out there. It was a bunch of lies. O and I'm glad you are doing well. Godbless.
[/quote]

Greg Valentino's muscles aren't huge from steroids. They're not even real muscle. He injected something called "synthol" into his muscles. He's crazy. Synthol is basically a mixture of oils. Rumor had it that Arnold Schwarzenegger injected it into his arms.

Here's a picture of a couple of guys who also overdid the synthol ( A lot of bodybuilders use synthol. That's why their muscles don't look real. They're not.. But at least they don't do it to the extent of these guys..)

[img]http://www.bodybuildingblog.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/synthol2.jpg[/img]

Edited January 23, 2011 by southern california guy

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='southern california guy' timestamp='1295758373' post='2203279']
Aren't you talking about "steroids" like cortisone -- which is an anti-inflammatory? They're quite a bit different than anabolic "steroids". And they can be catabolic (Cause the muscle to break down rather than build up). Here's the definition from Wikipedia.

[...]

[...] 200 now.
[/quote]
Yes, there are different types of steroids, and yes, the drug I took was a steroid. It was not anabolic, but it was a steroid nonetheless.

[Mark of the Cross]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' timestamp='1295724521' post='2203097']
I agree with you on marijuana. I think it needs to be legalized.
[/quote]

Drugs acting on the brain have the potential to trigger mental illnesses in people with a propensity for those illnesses. There is a strong link between Marijuana use and schizophrenia. Recreational drugs should be avoided except for the possibility of pain relief in the terminally ill.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Mark of the Cross' timestamp='1295784249' post='2203394']

Drugs acting on the brain have the potential to trigger mental illnesses in people with a propensity for those illnesses. There is a strong link between Marijuana use and schizophrenia. Recreational drugs should be avoided except for the possibility of pain relief in the terminally ill.
[/quote]
Alcohol can be dangerous for some people too, but thank God that's not illegal. I'd rather let people make their own choices on the matter.