Sternhauser Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1295570326' post='2202383'] eh..ok.. as a man, i can't fully appreciate the pangs of birth...but i still know it hurts like heck, and i would do anything i could to assist, and it doesn't hinder my ability to have the utmost respect for moms. your theory is harmless. proceed. [/quote] Men and women are complementary. Catholicism and false faiths are not. You are comparing apples and oranges. ~Sternhauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerCatholic Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 My mom was not Catholic when she married my dad, but she converted sometime after I was born. I do think she converted for the right reasons though, knowing her love for the Church. I have never asked what finally convinced her though. I wish I knew, so I could contribute something more to the topic. I did go out with a guy who was interested in the Catholic Church, though he was not in RCIA. I did go to Mass with him a few times and we even prayed the Rosary once together. However, for some reason he decided that he'd rather be pagan and worship the Greek gods (don't ask, he was a Classics major). Or at least, that's how I understood his message. It profoundly disturbed me, and I broke up with him the cowardly way via Facebook. We maintained a friendly acquaintance relationship after that. However, the incident made me realize how important it was that a man I might date should be Catholic especially since dating is very close to discerning marriage. Even though I'm not dating now, nor intend to since I'm tentatively discerning religious life, I would much prefer someone whose Catholic faith is important to them as mine is to me. So, I would approach dating a non-Catholic very cautiously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcts Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 My dad isn't Catholic. Maybe we aren't the norm, but I can honestly NEVER remember that being a problem. My brothers and I accepted the fact that my dad is Christian, but he just doesn't believe what we believe, which is what is true. When my mom is out of town or sick or for whatever reason cannot get us to Mass, my dad takes us. He is ok, even encourages us to be active in our faith (youth group, prayer groups, parish council, etc) and until this semester, one of us (I have two brothers) have been in Catholic school and he has been very supportive of that. There is your "example of a marriage where the wedding was Catholic and the other spouse understood that the children would be raised Catholic." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southern california guy Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 (edited) For a long time I was convinced that if she was also pro-life than we had a lot in common even if we were from different religions. I think that if you have similar morals then it may work but different religions definitely have different perspectives. When it came to Mormonism I agreed with most of the morality that they preached. However Mormonism didn't seem to be a religion of moderation. Historically the Mormons had multiple wives and either did things to excess -- or didn't do them at all. I believe in a little more balanced life. I think that Catholicism is a little more of a religion of moderation rather than an "all or nothing". Unless you talk about the Priests and Nuns and celibacy rather than marriage. But Catholicism allows more privacy than other religions. With Mormonism I didn't care for their level of control. If you get involved with that religion you're going to have a lot of people telling you what to do -- and there are a lot of "busybodies" in that culture. There's a lot of gossip, a lot of rumors, and a lot of lying... And this is all totally aside of the "religion". But if you look at the head of their religion, Monson is a really good guy. They've perhaps got the best guy leading their religion of any religion today. So the whole thing is confusing... If you date somebody from a different religion you're really dating somebody from a different culture. I've asked "Christian" women out and they've told me that they would "Put it before Jesus". Then they told me that they'd prayed about it and decided not to go out with me -- but they wanted to continue talking on the phone and e-mailing. Which left me totally confused.. (I would figure that there was something wrong at that point and give up). I think it's perhaps harder to date somebody of a different religion, but both of my sisters married guys of other religions and both marriages have worked our very well. So who knows? Edited January 21, 2011 by southern california guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 [quote name='Sternhauser' timestamp='1295573608' post='2202406'] Men and women are complementary. Catholicism and false faiths are not. You are comparing apples and oranges. ~Sternhauser [/quote] i like apples and oranges... you are still harmless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinytherese Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 [quote name='HisChildForever' timestamp='1295543086' post='2202232'] Those are all very valid concerns. There are plenty of members here who can answer your questions, I just wanted to throw in a question of my own: never mind marriage to a non-Catholic, how do you [i]date[/i] a non-Catholic and "make it work"? I have never dated a solid Catholic, I have only ever dated atheists and agnostics (you like someone, you want to make it work you know), and it is just exhausting, particularly in matters of chastity. I have found that not only do I have to work on my self-control and guard my purity, but I have to take on [i]his[/i] as well since it is not something he is conscious of or cares much about. I actually find dating to be a hindrance now because the issue of faith and purity is going to come up one way or another, and it is just one of those eye-rolling "here we go again" scenarios LOL. [/quote] I honestly think that both people need to be committed to chastity in order for it to work. I've also been in a situation with a guy friend where I felt like I had to be the one who would carry the ball purity wise for both of us even though we weren't seeing each other. I felt responible for his purity as well as my own. He was a devout Catholic who was all for waiting until marriage, but he wasn't modest in speech and at times would be way too blunt with me about his struggles. I remember once when he IMed me, asking me what he should do in his sexually aroused state (and that's putting it nicely. Truth be told, he was very crass about what he felt and I was really uncomfortable.) I know that I've been told that when it comes to marriage, what really matters is that they have the same values, but what values specifically. And when it comes to having the same moral views wouldn't that be with an orthodox Catholic, especially when it comes to life issues. I'm sure I can even fathom marrying someone who wasn't pro-life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thessalonian Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Having dated outside the faith and married someone who WAS outside the faith I will say this. Lots of drawbacks and problems to work through. They can be worked if there is an openness to the CC. They can also be a living hell at times. Best bet is to try stay in the faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sternhauser Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 [quote name='MIkolbe' timestamp='1295623363' post='2202511'] i like apples and oranges... you are still harmless. [/quote] I agree. ~Sternhauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papist Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 I know and met many mixed marriage couples that all was fine and dandy until they had children. Problem was they never seriously discussed how to raise children prior to marriage. Who's faith, how to discipline, etc. My three brothers all married a non-Catholic. I see it it them the deep desire to share thier faith with thier wives with the children. What I am saying is be sure you both communicate thoroughly all what is key for both of you. Here's a good article, [url="http://foryourmarriage.org/catholic-marriage/church-teachings/interfaith-marriages/"]http://foryourmarriage.org/catholic-marriage/church-teachings/interfaith-marriages/[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southern california guy Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 [quote name='Papist' timestamp='1295665183' post='2202900'] I know and met many mixed marriage couples that all was fine and dandy until they had children. Problem was they never seriously discussed how to raise children prior to marriage. Who's faith, how to discipline, etc. My three brothers all married a non-Catholic. I see it it them the deep desire to share thier faith with thier wives with the children. What I am saying is be sure you both communicate thoroughly all what is key for both of you. Here's a good article, [url="http://foryourmarriage.org/catholic-marriage/church-teachings/interfaith-marriages/"]http://foryourmarriage.org/catholic-marriage/church-teachings/interfaith-marriages/[/url] [/quote] Now if you marry a non-Catholic than you can't get married in the Catholic church, right? Would the Catholic church consider that marriage "valid"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcts Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 [quote name='southern california guy' timestamp='1295804260' post='2203433'] Now if you marry a non-Catholic than you can't get married in the Catholic church, right? Would the Catholic church consider that marriage "valid"? [/quote] If I understand your question, yes, a Catholic can marry a non-Catholic validly, in the Catholic Church. My mommy and daddy did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southern california guy Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 [quote name='mcts' timestamp='1295805122' post='2203436'] If I understand your question, yes, a Catholic can marry a non-Catholic validly, in the Catholic Church. My mommy and daddy did [/quote] But for the marriage to be valid it would have to be in the Catholic church, right? Or can a Catholic validly marry an non-Catholic outside of the Catholic church? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sternhauser Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 (edited) [quote name='southern california guy' timestamp='1295807423' post='2203446'] But for the marriage to be valid it would have to be in the Catholic church, right? Or can a Catholic validly marry an non-Catholic outside of the Catholic church? [/quote] In ordinary circumstances, it would have to be a Catholic wedding officiated by a priest and with at least two witnesses present, yes. And if one were marrying a non-Catholic, it would require the permission of the local bishop. But the man and woman confer the sacrament on themselves. Then you can get into all sorts of crazy things like marriage by proxy, as well. ~Sternhauser Edited January 23, 2011 by Sternhauser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papist Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 (edited) [quote name='southern california guy' timestamp='1295804260' post='2203433'] Now if you marry a non-Catholic than you can't get married in the Catholic church, right? Would the Catholic church consider that marriage "valid"? [/quote] It is not that black and white. It is very complex b/c there are numerous scenarios, non-Catholic Christan, unbaptized Christian, muslim, Buddhist, etc. But I'll try and layout the basic requirements for a valid Catholic wedding. 1) The couple must be capable of being married…that is, they must be a woman and a man who are free of any impediment that would prevent marriage. 2) The couple must give their consent to be married…that is, by an act of their will they irreversibly give and accept one another in order to establish marriage. 3) They must follow the canonical form for marriage…that is, they must be married according to the laws of the Church so that the Church and the wider community will be certain about the validity of their marriage. I'll try to break down the Impediments to marriage. First, both people must be capable of being married and free of any impediment (obstacle) that would prevent marriage. Some impediments to marriage include: [u]Age[/u]: Both persons need to be old enough to contract marriage according to the local civil laws. (The Church has a minimum age requirement as well) [u]Previous marriage[/u]: You cannot marry someone else if you are already married. This most common impediment to marriage. [u]Relatives[/u]: You cannot marry someone who is already your relative. [u]Reason[/u]: Anyone who is incapable of understanding what marriage is and the responsibilities that come with it (because of mental impairment, for instance) cannot enter marriage. [u]Fear[/u]: No one can be forced into marriage, either directly or because of some "grave fear". Here are some FAQs on Catholic Marriage. [url="http://www.usccb.org/laity/marriage/marriagefaqs.shtml"]http://www.usccb.org...riagefaqs.shtml[/url] I hope this helps. Edited January 23, 2011 by Papist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papist Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Sternhauser' timestamp='1295811441' post='2203482'] In ordinary circumstances, it would have to be a Catholic wedding officiated by a priest and with at least two witnesses present, yes. And if one were marrying a non-Catholic, it would require the permission of the local bishop. But the man and woman confer the sacrament on themselves. Then you can get into all sorts of crazy things like marriage by proxy, as well. ~Sternhauser [/quote] Yes. Catholic marrying a non-Catholic does need a dispensation from his local Bishop to be a valid marriage in the Church. Actually, there is no priest requirement...unless you want a nuptial wedding. What Catholic wouldn't want that. Edited January 23, 2011 by Papist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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