HopefulBride Posted October 1, 2010 Share Posted October 1, 2010 (edited) Are they in union with Rome? I remember reading somewhere that there was a split within the order and there is now a branch that is not in union. Are the ones affiliated with Saint Benedict Center in union? Thanks, HB Edit for..... you guessed it Typos (we need a spell-checker) Edited October 1, 2010 by HopefulBride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MithLuin Posted October 2, 2010 Share Posted October 2, 2010 It is my understanding that the St. Benedict Center in Massachusetts is in union with Rome, but the St. Benedict Center in New Hampshire is perhaps more sketch. The founder was reconciled with the Church and his ex-communication was lifted before his death. But still...tread cautiously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksterling Posted October 2, 2010 Share Posted October 2, 2010 Is it just me or what - but I find use of the word "slaves" to be creepy. Yes, I get what they mean but, frankly, I think God would prefer joyous givers and the definition of "slave" suggests involuntary servitude. Yuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherie Posted October 2, 2010 Share Posted October 2, 2010 [quote name='ksterling' timestamp='1286027080' post='2177490'] Is it just me or what - but I find use of the word "slaves" to be creepy. Yes, I get what they mean but, frankly, I think God would prefer joyous givers and the definition of "slave" suggests involuntary servitude. Yuck. [/quote] It comes from the work of St. Louis de Montfort, where he frequently uses the term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaPetiteSoeur Posted October 3, 2010 Share Posted October 3, 2010 [quote name='HopefulBride' timestamp='1285966246' post='2177363'] Are they in union with Rome? I remember reading somewhere that there was a split within the order and there is now a branch that is not in union. Are the ones affiliated with Saint Benedict Center in union? Thanks, HB Edit for..... you guessed it Typos (we need a spell-checker) [/quote] If you have issues with Feenyism, tread [b]very[/b] carefully with this order. They believe that there is no salvation outside of the Catholic faith. It is a beautiful order that I looked into, until I learned about their Feenyism beliefs. Dieu vous benisse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksterling Posted October 3, 2010 Share Posted October 3, 2010 Understand about de Monfort - still creepy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MithLuin Posted October 3, 2010 Share Posted October 3, 2010 Didn't he write in French? I know that slave/serf/servant are distinct words, but they probably are often translated or hold different connotations in different languages. Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but 'servus' is the Latin for 'slave.' So, when the pope calls himself 'the servant of the servants of God', he is using the Latin word for 'slave.' In Romans 1:1, Paul calls himself a servant of God...or a slave. I've seen it translated both ways, though I do not know enough about the languages to know which it [i]should[/i] be, or what precisely the word he used meant. Anyway, I agree that the use of 'slave' is a bit creepy, and I'm more comfortable with JPII's 'Totus Tuus' - all yours is just a nicer way of putting that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiquitunga Posted October 3, 2010 Share Posted October 3, 2010 I think the word slave in English is the right word though for Montfortian Spirituality. If you read [i]True Devotion to Mary[/i], you'll get what I mean. I'm not sure what term he would have used in French, but again I believe slave is the best translation. He even speaks of wearing a little chain as a sign of your slavery. I have been looking into getting one of these. They have a [url="http://www.saintbenedict.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=HMH_B1141&Category_Code=RJ"]silver bracelet[/url] one in their gift shop, but it's a bit expensive. Still, it would be a nice thing to ask for for Christmas maybe. I once saw a priest wearing one just like this. It looked great! I am sure the devil hates these! He would rather we be slaves of him .. slaves of sin. To be a slave of Jesus through Mary is true freedom! What creeps me out about this particular community though is, as LaPetiteSoeur pointed out, their Feenyism beliefs .. They do not believe in baptism of desire or baptism by blood .. strange .. And this is not just a Traditional kind of thing. Even the SSPX has a book against it .. [url="http://www.amazon.com/Feeneyism-Catholic-Meaning-Outside-Salvation/dp/1892331047/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1286123184&sr=8-1-spell"][i]Is Feenyism Catholic?[/i][/url] Still, they are in union with Rome .. but they have these particular beliefs .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cherie Posted October 3, 2010 Share Posted October 3, 2010 [quote name='Chiquitunga' timestamp='1286123966' post='2177631'] What creeps me out about this particular community though is, as LaPetiteSoeur pointed out, their Feenyism beliefs .. They do not believe in baptism of desire or baptism by blood .. strange .. And this is not just a Traditional kind of thing. Even the SSPX has a book against it .. [url="http://www.amazon.com/Feeneyism-Catholic-Meaning-Outside-Salvation/dp/1892331047/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1286123184&sr=8-1-spell"][i]Is Feenyism Catholic?[/i][/url] Still, they are in union with Rome .. but they have these particular beliefs .. [/quote] Wow, I didn't realize that! How can they claim union with Rome but hold to such beliefs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freudentaumel Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 [quote name='MithLuin'] Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but 'servus' is the Latin for 'slave.' So, when the pope calls himself 'the servant of the servants of God', he is using the Latin word for 'slave.' [/quote] "Servus" can mean "servant", "slave" but more in the sense of servant (which normally were slaves). If the "ownership" of the person is to be stressed, the Latin word would be "mancipium", which is the word that this order uses. So they explicitly do not use the same title as the pope. [quote name='CherieMadame' timestamp='1286139804' post='2177665'] Wow, I didn't realize that! How can they claim union with Rome but hold to such beliefs? [/quote] Because none of their beliefs is against any Dogma of the faith. Neither Baptism of Blood nor Baptism of Desire are Dogmas, they are theological speculations that anyone can disagree with. "Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus" is a defined dogma, however there are lots of interpretations. According to (then) Cardinal Ratzinger the Church has to give those with a strict interpretation the same liberty as those with a liberal interpretation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yaatee Posted October 5, 2010 Share Posted October 5, 2010 [quote name='CherieMadame' timestamp='1286139804' post='2177665'] Wow, I didn't realize that! How can they claim union with Rome but hold to such beliefs? [/quote] Father Feeney returned to Rome before he died. I think that St. Benedict Center soft-pedals his beliefs and the separation now. I remember years ago when you opened the page to the St. B center or the order for men, the English translation of [i]Extra ecclesiam nulla salus[/i] was on a large banner. I don't like "slaves" either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HopefulBride Posted October 5, 2010 Author Share Posted October 5, 2010 So the two communites are of the same belief? it didn't seem so from what I have been reading about them and on their sites. I am not discerning with them but wanted some info on the order. I came accross something on them (I think it might have been a sister who talked about them in a video) and I got curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strgzr00 Posted October 7, 2010 Share Posted October 7, 2010 [quote name='HopefulBride' timestamp='1286319307' post='2178075'] So the two communiites are of the same belief? it didn't seem so from what I have been reading about them and on their sites. I am not discerning with them but wanted some info on the order. I came across something on them (I think it might have been a sister who talked about them in a video) and I got curious. [/quote] It's the[i] tone [/i]of their writings that bothers me. at their own websites: [url="http://catholicism.org/category/the-slaves-of-the-immaculate-heart-of-mary"]http://catholicism.o...e-heart-of-mary[/url] [url="http://catholicism.org/our-status-in-the-church.html"]http://catholicism.o...the-church.html[/url] ...sort of an equivocation and defensiveness and lots of files you can download with, as they point out to you, letterheads intact, which say that they are in the church--now. But their emphasis on[i] extra ecclesiam nulla salu[/i]s is the same, maybe somewhat reinterpreted. Also a veiled criticism of BXVI's recent address to prelates in Brazil. Also the fact that they are not recognized as canonical in the diocese of Manchester NH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaboureSociety Posted October 7, 2010 Share Posted October 7, 2010 VERY IMPORTANT DISTINCTIONS 2 DIFFERENT GROUPS - BOTH STILL USE TITLE SAINT BENEDICT'S CENTER; BOTH COMMUNITIES IN STILL RIVER, MA; LOGO'S ARE VIRTUALLY IDENTICAL These Sisters: In communion (I Verified with Diocese): [url="http://sistersofstbenedictcenter.org/"]http://sistersofstbenedictcenter.org/[/url] -we just had an Aspirant enter this community. A WONDERFUL young woman. These Sisters: In communion? : http://www.saintbenedict.com/[color="#000000"] This[/color] history may help:http://www.saintbenedict.com/theorder/history.html Note they state they were regularized by the diocese at the end after professing the creed. I have not verified this, however. Hope this helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freudentaumel Posted October 16, 2010 Share Posted October 16, 2010 The Bishop of Manchester has appointed a priest to say mass and hear confessions in the Saint Benedict Center in New Hampshire. ([url=http://catholicism.org/very-good-news-a-new-priest-for-sbc.html]Link[/url]) This does not mean that the group in NH is now officially recognized, however it clearly means that they are in full communion and the relations with the diocese are improving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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