Mrs. Bro. Adam Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='Inquisitor Generalis' date='Feb 15 2006, 10:11 PM']1. Failing to crack down on the charismatic movement is one of many things JPII will have to answer for. May God forgive him. 2. I've never tried to "regulate" anything. I'm just trying to get you ppl to actually think like Catholics and not Pentecostals. [right][snapback]888934[/snapback][/right] [/quote] 1. This is not for you to say, or even assume. He supported the movement, not the abuses which took place within the movement. Big difference. Nothing condemnable. 2. Perhaps you should take some of your own advice.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezic Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 Catholics are Pentacostal in the truest sense of the word. We should be at least. If you aren't, there is a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azriel Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 Amen to that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azriel Posted February 17, 2006 Share Posted February 17, 2006 [quote name='Brother Adam' date='Feb 16 2006, 06:15 PM']I'm saying he isn't orthodox - by comments like this: [right][snapback]889712[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I stand corrected. However, the point is everyone needs to remember phorum guidelines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YMNolan Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 just to get back to what this thread began as... if one has the gift of tongues, what should they do with it? try to figure out which language they are speaking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jswranch Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 [quote name='God Conquers' date='Feb 15 2006, 09:57 PM']Montanism has nothing to do with the charismatic movement other than the fact that both claim to exercise of the holy spirit. One group is heretical and led by a man claiming he was perferist's salvific act., the other is clearly of a fundamentally different nature. [right][snapback]888928[/snapback][/right] [/quote] True, Montanism has nothing to do with the current charismatic movement. True, speaking in tongues does exist as we know from scripture. What I was trying to bring attention to was the church's view of it when I quoted: [quote name='jswranch' date='Feb 15 2006, 05:29 PM'][color=green]... Such exterior gifts need to be tempered by humility and obedience to the Church, since Satan can more easily counterfeit them... [right][snapback]888700[/snapback][/right] [/quote] (I suppose Satan can also attempt to counterfeit our interpretation of scripture) for Nolan's "If one has the gift of tongues, what should they do with it?" Find a charismatic group in which to use it. Perhaps the use of tongues is also good in private prayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 There are many previous threads on this topic, which you can find using our search feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 [quote name='Inquisitor Generalis' date='Feb 16 2006, 10:46 PM']What does that have to do w/orthodoxy? There are a lot of ppl who did not follow Abp. Lefebvre, but still have a high degree of respect for that man. Many Indulters, for example, will admit that there likely would not have been an Indult if it wasn't for him. [right][snapback]889907[/snapback][/right] [/quote] So, are you saying a "good" came from an "evil?" You are incorrect and so are those that think that there wouldn't be an indult if not for Archbishop Lefevbre. In 1984, FOUR FULL YEARS, before the illicit consecrations by the late Archbishop Lefevbre. I would point you to the document [url="http://www.catholicliturgy.com/index.cfm/FuseAction/DocumentContents/Index/2/SubIndex/11/DocumentIndex/395"]Quattuor Abhinc Annos[/url]. It was put forth from the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments. Your logic is faulty. And you are flat out wrong. If you'd like to discuss the nuance of Dante's Divine Comedy, I'd be happy to indulge you. I studied it rather heavily in my undergrad days, while pursuing my Catholic Studies degree. I rather enjoyed it and would love to revisit this great work. Would you like to read through it in English or in the original Italian? Either works for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brendan1104 Posted May 31, 2006 Share Posted May 31, 2006 Cam, you know just as well as I do, that many bishops did not "allow" the indult until Archbishop Lefebvre consecrated the bishops, and they do in the majority of places only because there's an SSPX/indpt./sede chapel in the area... [quote name='Cam42' post='891101' date='Feb 18 2006, 10:21 AM'] So, are you saying a "good" came from an "evil?" You are incorrect and so are those that think that there wouldn't be an indult if not for Archbishop Lefevbre. In 1984, FOUR FULL YEARS, before the illicit consecrations by the late Archbishop Lefevbre. I would point you to the document [url="http://www.catholicliturgy.com/index.cfm/FuseAction/DocumentContents/Index/2/SubIndex/11/DocumentIndex/395"]Quattuor Abhinc Annos[/url]. It was put forth from the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments. Your logic is faulty. And you are flat out wrong. If you'd like to discuss the nuance of Dante's Divine Comedy, I'd be happy to indulge you. I studied it rather heavily in my undergrad days, while pursuing my Catholic Studies degree. I rather enjoyed it and would love to revisit this great work. Would you like to read through it in English or in the original Italian? Either works for me. [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristen Posted June 13, 2006 Share Posted June 13, 2006 I think Fr. Mike Scanlon (FUS) claims that Pope John Paul II spoke in tongues when they said mass together (in Fr. Mike's autobiography). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oik Posted June 13, 2006 Share Posted June 13, 2006 Kristen, I have heard this from some on campus at FUS. I don't know if this is true or not (that is, if it is in his book or not). I haven't read anything from or about Fr. Scanlon yet. I didn't vote because my option itsn't there. Generally though, the charism of speaking in tongues seems to be becoming more definded. I used to get a lot of different repsonses by Charismatic Catholics. Nowadays though, there seems to be a general consensus on what it is and etc. From my experience, Catholics involved in the charismatic movement/renewal explain it as a langauge between you and the Holy Spirit. A language of prayer. It sounds like it doesn't make sense to those listening. It is a personal thing, not meant for interpretation (which is Speaking in Tonuges and requires an interpreter). The Catholics involved in the charismatic movement/renewal in a way call to mind for me, the ecstatic prophets in the Old Testament. I don't know if it is in the Bible or not. I haven't studied it enough in context. It's hard to say. Either way though, it is like any other approved spiritual practice. It has to be used properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristen Posted June 13, 2006 Share Posted June 13, 2006 Fr. Mike writes in his book something like, when they said mass together they both groaned utterings to the Holy Spirit. I think it is purposley left to be a bit ambiguous, but I took it to be his way of saying speaking in tongues. Wish I would have asked Fr. Mike directly when I had the chance, maybe someday I will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelF Posted June 25, 2006 Share Posted June 25, 2006 [quote name='brendan1104' post='993692' date='May 31 2006, 04:15 PM'] and they do in the majority of places only because there's an SSPX/indpt./sede chapel in the area... [/quote] Source, please? I know that to be untrue, at least in my home Diocese (Pensacola-Tallahassee). Also, is the Indult Mass neccessary for Salvation? No. Vernacular NO, Latin NO, the Tridentine Mass, or any of the several Divine Liturgies will do. Nor is the Tridentine Mass a meterstick for Orthodoxy, as is sometimes implied. It's nice. I like it, but prefer a Latin NO (that being the Mass of the Latin Church). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironman Posted June 27, 2006 Share Posted June 27, 2006 At SCRC this year they have FR. Benedict Groeschel.....he's awesome and he's down for the Charasmatics.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resurrexi Posted July 6, 2006 Share Posted July 6, 2006 [mod] - inDEED[/mod] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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