" I'm A Man"

[Lil Red]

[url="http://www.faithandfamilylive.com/features/im_a_man"]From Faith and Family[/url]
[i]Steve Gershom (a pseudonym) is a young, Catholic professional who recently came out as a homosexual to friends and family.[/i]

[b]What advice would you give to a Catholic who thinks he might be homosexual?[/b]

First, don’t assume that you’re “gay” and that’s that. I think of homosexuality as a spectrum, and there are plenty of people in the middle for part or all of their lives. Find a priest to talk to who is both orthodox and understanding. Isolation gets you into bad mental habits. Find a support group that you’re comfortable with: Courage is one, and there are dozens of others. Finally, pray a lot. You won’t be able to “pray it away,” but prayer, adoration, and frequent communion and confession make everything better. Of course, that goes for anyone with any kind of a cross to bear. Which is everyone.

[b]What advice would you give to parents who are concerned about their son’s sexual identity?[/b]

It’s terribly important for fathers to be accessible, emotionally and otherwise, to their sons; to spend regular one-on-one time with them; to praise them when they do well; and to give them lots of physical affection, from early on. I mean really early—we think of the adolescent years as being particularly formative, but a person’s emotional makeup can be drastically affected, for good or ill, from day one.

If the horse is already out of the barn, then first educate yourself [see below for recommended reading], and then talk to your son, in a careful, loving way. That is going to hurt a lot, for both of you, but not talking is much worse. He needs to know that you’re not scared or disgusted.

[b]Do you think that you might be able to become heterosexual, or that anyone can?[/b]

I believe some degree of change is possible. Ex-gay groups are caricatured as brainwashers and Bible-thumpers, who will tell you how depraved you are, and to squash your feelings down into the back of your psyche.
My experience with one group is the exact opposite. The work I did with People Can Change would benefit almost every man I know: they helped me to open old, badly-healed wounds, confront old fears and prejudices, and dismantle some of the lies I had been telling myself. It was scary and it hurt like hell, but it left me with the beginnings of a peace and confidence I had never experienced before.

Has it made me less attracted to men, or more attracted to women? Yes, a little bit. But more importantly, it has made me a less fearful, more integrated person. That’s a work in progress.

Maybe I’ll be able to get married and have children, maybe not. But the one sure way to be miserable is to obsess about the things you don’t have, and forget to give thanks for the things you do have. I have a lot.

[b]Is there anything you wish you could change about the Church’s teaching on homosexuality?[/b]
Not a thing. Without the Church’s clear teaching on the issue, I would have been at the mercy of my badly confused emotions. When your instincts are misleading, you need something unshakable. The Church is a rock.
On the other hand, I do think the Church’s approach to the topic needs work, and badly. You might hear a sermon or two about gay marriage, but that’s not terribly helpful. Catholics often talk about homosexual men as if they were another species—who should of course be pitied and prayed for: Those poor freaks!

This isn’t due to ill will, obviously. It’s because people are embarrassed, are scared of offending someone, and have been badly misinformed by all the cultural propaganda.

[b]If you could clear up one common misunderstanding about homosexuals, what would it be?[/b]

I don’t believe that “gay” is a valid category, the way “male” and “female” are. I used to think being gay meant being a different kind of person altogether—like a third gender. These days I think that it’s something I have, not something I am.

The surprising thing is that gay men are gay because they are masculine, not because they are feminine. What I mean is this: men, gay and straight, want to know they’re real men. If something stops them from believing that, then they’ll go looking for that manhood for the rest of their lives.

Some men look for it by finding a man who will give them acceptance and affection—or at least sex. These are the men we call “gay.” Some men look for it by sleeping with a lot of women and picking a lot of fights. These are the men we call, well, “jerks.” But both of them are the way they are, and want the things they want, because of the specifically masculine traits they started out with.

The best way to sum it up is something a very good priest once said to me in confession. He said, “You’re not a homosexual. You’re a man.”

[Nihil Obstat]

That's a great article. Something that everyone can learn something from.
I especially liked this part:

" But more importantly, it has made me a less fearful, more integrated person. That’s a work in progress. "

That's the important thing, isn't it? Everyone has particular sins they'll struggle with. The important part is not what those sins are, but how you address it and deal with it. That goes for everyone.

[let_go_let_God]

I want to find the priest he went to confession to, go to confession myself and give him a hug for saying that.

God bless-
LGLG

[Hilde]

[quote]Not a thing. Without the Church’s clear teaching on the issue, I would have been at the mercy of my badly confused emotions. When your instincts are misleading, you need something unshakable. The Church is a rock.[/quote]I like this.

[Ed Normile]

I found this confusing, he promotes receiving and adoration but does not clarify if he is a chaste homosexual. He also adds the name of a group he found helpful and said he believes some degree of change is possible when asked if he thought he or anyone could become a heterosexual. Then when asked if he thought it could make him less attracted to men, or more attracted to women he adds "Yes, a little bit. But more importantly, it has made me a less fearful, more integrated person. That’s a work in progress." Does this mean he is now Bi-sexual?

ed

[TeresaBenedicta]

[quote name='Ed Normile' date='04 August 2010 - 04:19 PM' timestamp='1280949549' post='2152113']
I found this confusing, he promotes receiving and adoration but does not clarify if he is a chaste homosexual. He also adds the name of a group he found helpful and said he believes some degree of change is possible when asked if he thought he or anyone could become a heterosexual. Then when asked if he thought it could make him less attracted to men, or more attracted to women he adds "Yes, a little bit. But more importantly, it has made me a less fearful, more integrated person. That’s a work in progress." Does this mean he is now Bi-sexual?

ed
[/quote]

I think with his clear support of the Church's teachings, he's chaste.

As for becoming a "bi-sexual", I don't think so. Like he said, he finds homosexuality something more like a spectrum. Not something where "You're gay" or "You're heterosexual". It's more sliding than that.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='Ed Normile' date='04 August 2010 - 01:19 PM' timestamp='1280949549' post='2152113']
I found this confusing, he promotes receiving and adoration but does not clarify if he is a chaste homosexual. He also adds the name of a group he found helpful and said he believes some degree of change is possible when asked if he thought he or anyone could become a heterosexual. Then when asked if he thought it could make him less attracted to men, or more attracted to women he adds "Yes, a little bit. But more importantly, it has made me a less fearful, more integrated person. That’s a work in progress." Does this mean he is now Bi-sexual?

ed
[/quote]
The group that he advocates (Courage) is one that promotes chastity for those struggling with same-sex attraction. There is another group (Dignity, I believe) that is not orthodox in its approach. So I'd say that this gentleman is chaste. You should also note this statement about what he'd change in Church teaching: "Not a thing. Without the Church’s clear teaching on the issue, I would have been at the mercy of my badly confused emotions. When your instincts are misleading, you need something unshakable. The Church is a rock." I think that statement is true no matter what sin you're struggling with.

As far as the question about attraction ... I have a dear friend, B, who has worked in ministry to people wanting to come out of the gay lifestyle for nearly two decades. My friend worked in an organization affiliated with Exodus, which is basically the Protestant counterpart of Courage. B himself struggled with SSA as a younger man, but through God's grace was able to deal with many emotional and psychological issues that he says contributed to his disordered attraction. B is now married (has been for I think 17 years) and has two sons. He said he no longer feels attraction for men, but he too talked about it like attraction is a spectrum, and it is not a fixed thing like we talk about it. He says now he exclusively feels attraction for his wife, and he has worked with other men who have experienced similar change. Others, he says, have been able to achieve chastity.

This guy isn't there yet, it doesn't sound like, but he has experienced healing to a certain degree, and he sounds like he is focusing on seeing himself as a person who is not defined by his attractions, and on growing in holiness. I think that's a pretty good place to be.

[Ed Normile]

[quote name='Terra Firma' date='04 August 2010 - 02:52 PM' timestamp='1280951556' post='2152130']
The group that he advocates (Courage) is one that promotes chastity for those struggling with same-sex attraction. There is another group (Dignity, I believe) that is not orthodox in its approach. So I'd say that this gentleman is chaste. You should also note this statement about what he'd change in Church teaching: "[b]Not a thing. Without the Church's clear teaching on the issue, I would have been at the mercy of my badly confused emotions. When your instincts are misleading, you need something unshakable. The Church is a rock."[/b] I think that statement is true no matter what sin you're struggling with.

As far as the question about attraction ... I have a dear friend, B, who has worked in ministry to people wanting to come out of the gay lifestyle for nearly two decades. My friend worked in an organization affiliated with Exodus, which is basically the Protestant counterpart of Courage. B himself struggled with SSA as a younger man, but through God's grace was able to deal with many emotional and psychological issues that he says contributed to his disordered attraction. B is now married (has been for I think 17 years) and has two sons. He said he no longer feels attraction for men, but he too talked about it like attraction is a spectrum, and it is not a fixed thing like we talk about it. He says now he exclusively feels attraction for his wife, and he has worked with other men who have experienced similar change. Others, he says, have been able to achieve chastity.

This guy isn't there yet, it doesn't sound like, but he has experienced healing to a certain degree, and he sounds like he is focusing on seeing himself as a person who is not defined by his attractions, and on growing in holiness. I think that's a pretty good place to be.
[/quote]

You are obviously more educated on this story and gentleman than I am, I only know this story from what was posted above in this thread and there was no reference about his sexuality save to say he is homosexual. This in my mind led me to believe, bolstered by the fact he mentions having gone to confession, that he may be struggling with chastity as a homosexual male. I made this assumption by the tenor of the article, which referred to his sexuality and his faith practises and left it to the reader to come to their own conclusions, with contradicting sentences like the one you left out of your above quote "[b]On the other hand, I do think the Church's approach to the topic needs work, and badly. You might hear a sermon or two about gay marriage, but that's not terribly helpful. Catholics often talk about homosexual men as if they were another species—who should of course be pitied and prayed for: Those poor freaks![/b] " which seems to directly nullify his preface to this line.

ed

Edited August 4, 2010 by Ed Normile

[Ed Normile]

[quote name='TeresaBenedicta' date='04 August 2010 - 02:26 PM' timestamp='1280949988' post='2152116']
I think with his clear support of the Church's teachings, he's chaste.

As for becoming a "bi-sexual", I don't think so. Like he said, he finds homosexuality something more like a spectrum. Not something where "You're gay" or "You're heterosexual". It's more sliding than that.
[/quote]

So, are you saying he believes in an anything goes lifestyle, sounds like Hedonism to me. What part of the spectrum do you think he is currently at, judging solely from the hints he supplied, he seems to offer that he is now more attracted to women, and now less attracted to men. I notice he said less attracted to men not uninterested, not repulsed, not even disinterested sexually to men. It seems to me that being attracted to both women and men sexually at any level may qualify you as bi-sexual, but then again I am an old guy and we are less tolerant of things like this.

ed

Edited August 4, 2010 by Ed Normile

[Sojourner]

[quote name='Ed Normile' date='04 August 2010 - 02:12 PM' timestamp='1280952775' post='2152152']
You are obviously more educated on this story and gentleman than I am, I only know this story from what was posted above in this thread and there was no reference about his sexuality save to say he is homosexual. This in my mind led me to believe, bolstered by the fact he mentions having gone to confession, that he may be struggling with chastity as a homosexual male. I made this assumption by the tenor of the article, which referred to his sexuality and his faith practises and left it to the reader to come to their own conclusions, with contradicting sentences like the one you left out of your above quote "[b]On the other hand, I do think the Church's approach to the topic needs work, and badly. You might hear a sermon or two about gay marriage, but that's not terribly helpful. Catholics often talk about homosexual men as if they were another species—who should of course be pitied and prayed for: Those poor freaks![/b] " which seems to directly nullify his preface to this line.

ed
[/quote]
I'm sorry ... I don't understand how it nullifies the previous sentence?

In the first sentence he's talking about Church teaching, and the second is about the application of that teaching in the life of the Church (what he calls the "Church's approach"). My read on this is that he has no beef with the Church teaching that homosexuality is wrong, but that he does have issues with how individuals in the Church approach ministering to those struggling with same-sex attraction.

I guess I didn't see that as a contradiction. There is often, in my opinion, a disconnect between what the Church teaches and how that teaching is actually put in practice in ministry.

As far as the chastity question ... he said, "Finally, pray a lot. You won’t be able to “pray it away,” but prayer, adoration, and frequent communion and confession make everything better. Of course, that goes for anyone with any kind of a cross to bear. Which is everyone." That indicated with me that he is addressing his sin by actively availing himself of the Sacraments, which is a good thing for anyone to do. He didn't specifically address whether he is currently living an unchaste lifestyle, but the signs I saw seemed to point to his goal of living chastely, whether he's actually achieved that or is still in the process of working on it.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='Ed Normile' date='04 August 2010 - 02:22 PM' timestamp='1280953368' post='2152162']
So, are you saying he believes in an anything goes lifestyle, sounds like Hedonism to me. What part of the spectrum do you think he is currently at, judging solely from the hints he supplied, he seems to offer that he is now more attracted to women, and now less attracted to men. I notice he said less attracted to men not uninterested, not repulsed, not even disinterested sexually to men. It seems to me that being attracted to both women and men sexually at any level may qualify you as bi-sexual, but then again I am an old guy and we are less tolerant of things like this.

ed
[/quote]
I don't think he's advocating hedonism or "anything goes" at all. I think he's advocating adherence to Church teaching, although he's being very open about the places in which he struggles or has struggled with that.

When he talks about the spectrum, he is referring to his own developments as far as attraction, not advocating that anything along the spectrum is "OK." I'm not sure where you get that from what he says.

He also seems to be distancing himself from identifying himself by his attractions. ("I don’t believe that “gay” is a valid category, the way “male” and “female” are. I used to think being gay meant being a different kind of person altogether—like a third gender. These days I think that it’s something I have, not something I am.") That is completely in step with the way the Catechism addresses this question.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Ed Normile' date='04 August 2010 - 03:12 PM' timestamp='1280952775' post='2152152']
You are obviously more educated on this story and gentleman than I am, I only know this story from what was posted above in this thread and there was no reference about his sexuality save to say he is homosexual. This in my mind led me to believe, bolstered by the fact he mentions having gone to confession, that he may be struggling with chastity as a homosexual male. I made this assumption by the tenor of the article, which referred to his sexuality and his faith practises and left it to the reader to come to their own conclusions, with contradicting sentences like the one you left out of your above quote "[b]On the other hand, I do think the Church's approach to the topic needs work, and badly. You might hear a sermon or two about gay marriage, but that's not terribly helpful. Catholics often talk about homosexual men as if they were another species—who should of course be pitied and prayed for: Those poor freaks![/b] " which seems to directly nullify his preface to this line.

ed
[/quote]


[quote name='Ed Normile' date='04 August 2010 - 03:22 PM' timestamp='1280953368' post='2152162']
So, are you saying he believes in an anything goes lifestyle, sounds like Hedonism to me. What part of the spectrum do you think he is currently at, judging solely from the hints he supplied, he seems to offer that he is now more attracted to women, and now less attracted to men. I notice he said less attracted to men not uninterested, not repulsed, not even disinterested sexually to men. It seems to me that being attracted to both women and men sexually at any level may qualify you as bi-sexual, but then again I am an old guy and we are less tolerant of things like this.

ed
[/quote]
Mr. Normile, I think you're looking for something in that article that just isn't there... namely scandal.

What I read is the thoughts of a man with a heavy cross, who bears it as well as he can, and in exactly the way we as a Church knows it is to be borne. Not sure what you were reading.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='04 August 2010 - 02:42 PM' timestamp='1280954527' post='2152177']
What I read is the thoughts of a man with a heavy cross, who bears it as well as he can, and in exactly the way we as a Church knows it is to be borne. Not sure what you were reading.
[/quote]

[TeresaBenedicta]

[quote name='Ed Normile' date='04 August 2010 - 05:22 PM' timestamp='1280953368' post='2152162']
So, are you saying he believes in an anything goes lifestyle, sounds like Hedonism to me. What part of the spectrum do you think he is currently at, judging solely from the hints he supplied, he seems to offer that he is now more attracted to women, and now less attracted to men. I notice he said less attracted to men not uninterested, not repulsed, not even disinterested sexually to men. It seems to me that being attracted to both women and men sexually at any level may qualify you as bi-sexual, but then again I am an old guy and we are less tolerant of things like this.

ed
[/quote]

Whoa. Not sure how you got hedonism out of any of that.

I don't know where he's at, but, at least from my reading, this young man is trying desperately to understand himself in light of the Gospel. He acknowledges that he is struggles with being attracted to men. And he recognizes that this doesn't define him. Rather, he recognizes that this type of attraction varies in intensity from person to person, even can vary [i]within[/i] an individual. He's experienced a shift, however small, in that level of attraction.

[TeresaBenedicta]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='04 August 2010 - 05:42 PM' timestamp='1280954527' post='2152177']
Mr. Normile, I think you're looking for something in that article that just isn't there... namely scandal.

[b]What I read is the thoughts of a man with a heavy cross, who bears it as well as he can, and in exactly the way we as a Church knows it is to be borne. Not sure what you were reading.[/b]
[/quote]

Well said, Nihil.