Gregorius Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 So, temporarily setting aside all arguments for/against government in general, imagine that you live under an oppressive regime that forces the Church underground again. It will be still possible to secretly practice the faith either way, so with that in mind, what regime [u]of the two above [/u]would you rather live under. I'll also post examples as to what could happen in each particular circumstance to get conversation going. 1.Government that has been corrupted to the fullest extent of Secularism. Pretends to be tolerant, but punishes any individual that even remotely attempts to assert objective truth, particularly Catholics, who are now branded as a hate group due especially to their refusal to accept homosexual sub-culture, branded misogynysts for their refusal to ordain women, decried for their refusal to participate in abortion on demand. May be subjected to heavy fines and/or imprisonment. The government may have advanced ways to moniter private lives. This government may be more likely to be a democracy. 2.Sharia Law. Islam is the law of the land, and those that disagree may either pay a heavy tax and be treated as a second-class citizen, convert to Islam, or die. God can be spoken about in public, and prayer is highly encouraged. Unfortunately, in public one must worship as the muslims do. Vigilante groups may attempt to terrorize the Christian populations, and authorities will most likely ignore them. Abortion, Sodomy in all forms, consumption of alcohol, blasphemy are all illegal. Punishments here may be harsher. Education is stressed more in this environment. For men at least. Women may or may not be so lucky. Oh yeah, and people like Hassan are made Sultan, and democracy is not part of an ordinary citizen's vocabulary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 No? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luigi Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 Extreme secular. 1. I'm more familiar with it. 2. Practice of the faith is a personal decision rather than a cultural norm. 3. Sounds like ancient Rome - just like the good old days of Catholicism! 4. The secular society is in greater need of Christian witness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregorius Posted July 9, 2010 Author Share Posted July 9, 2010 [quote name='Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam' date='09 July 2010 - 12:20 AM' timestamp='1278649253' post='2139668'] No? [/quote] This is a [u]theoretical[/u] situation. It's pretty much a given that in reality the Christian faithful would rather not live in either situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Gregorius' date='09 July 2010 - 01:38 AM' timestamp='1278650309' post='2139677'] This is a [u]theoretical[/u] situation. It's pretty much a given that in reality the Christian faithful would rather not live in either situation. [/quote] This is how I answer silly, unanswerable "either...or" questions- Denny's Lady: "Sausage or Bacon with your scrambled eggs?" Me: "Yes?" You: "Would you rather live under a completely Secular Government or under Sharia Law?" Me: "No?" (Bacon, if I must choose or both and just pay the extra 50 cents or whatever) Perhaps that is the best answer to such a question. I'd prefer to live under both. Edited July 9, 2010 by Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatherineM Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 The church would be forced underground in either case. My family has lived with that before. I have a 100+ year old pattern for a chasuble that is camouflaged as a quilt. I wouldn't mind be forced to publicly pray five times a day. I could even survive the clothing. I often look at the Muslim women in my neighborhood and think it must be nice to never have a bad hair day. Besides, half the year here, I cover more skin than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zunshynn Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 Interesting situation. I think being amidst an extremely secular government would be more dangerous spiritually speaking, than living under sharia law. I mean the way things are now, with how secular our culture is, you see it also influencing Christians alot... slowly but surely accepting secular errors, accepting materialism, etc. You might be more likely to suffer torture and death under sharia law, but I think it would be less likely to harm one's faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Normile Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 I wanna live in a dark chocolate covered strawberry factory. ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hilde Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 [quote name='Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam' date='09 July 2010 - 07:58 AM' timestamp='1278651496' post='2139687'] This is how I answer silly, unanswerable "either...or" questions- Denny's Lady: "Sausage or Bacon with your scrambled eggs?" Me: "Yes?" You: "Would you rather live under a completely Secular Government or under Sharia Law?" Me: "No?" (Bacon, if I must choose or both and just pay the extra 50 cents or whatever) Perhaps that is the best answer to such a question. I'd prefer to live under both. [/quote] I do that too! Ice cream or cake? yes is the answer. I also do it to more important this or that questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 [quote name='Gregorius' date='09 July 2010 - 12:17 AM' timestamp='1278649049' post='2139665'] . Oh yeah, and[b] people like Hassan are made Sultan[/b], and democracy is not part of an ordinary citizen's vocabulary. [/quote] Sounds like a great place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resurrexi Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 [quote name='CatherineM' date='09 July 2010 - 12:09 AM' timestamp='1278652163' post='2139694'] The church would be forced underground in either case. My family has lived with that before. I have a 100+ year old pattern for a chasuble that is camouflaged as a quilt. I wouldn't mind be forced to publicly pray five times a day. I could even survive the clothing. I often look at the Muslim women in my neighborhood and think it must be nice to never have a bad hair day. Besides, half the year here, I cover more skin than that. [/quote] I, for one, would definitely have a problem worshiping God in a manner contrary to the Catholic faith five times per day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatherineM Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 [quote name='Resurrexi' date='09 July 2010 - 01:12 AM' timestamp='1278655928' post='2139732'] I, for one, would definitely have a problem worshiping God in a manner contrary to the Catholic faith five times per day. [/quote] What's contrary to the Catholic faith about getting on one's knees five times a day to pray. I know women who pray the rosary 5-6 times a day. My husband has a friend who attends mass that many times a day. I have a rosary that belonged to my great-grandmother's great-grandmother. She knelt in the middle of the village square to say that rosary. She was imprisoned for doing so. I would like to think I could have that same courage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregorius Posted July 9, 2010 Author Share Posted July 9, 2010 Interesting. So there are certain people out there who would rather die than live under persecution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fides quarens intellectum Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 [quote name='Gregorius' date='09 July 2010 - 09:29 AM' timestamp='1278685799' post='2139859'] Interesting. So there are certain people out there who would rather die than live under persecution? [/quote] Which scenario are you thinking Christians would die under (and which one's the persecution)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 Since I prefer to be treated as a person and not a commodity, I voted for the first option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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