The Ppc

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

[quote name='JTheresa' date='14 July 2010 - 07:49 AM' timestamp='1279111749' post='2142466']
IgnatiusofLoyola's personal chapel ( maybe a little smaller )

[img]http://images.travelpod.com/users/chickensafloat/carribean_tour.1172400180.convent_of_st_jerome.jpg[/img]

The Convent of Saint Jerome's main chapel.

[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/drool.gif[/img]
Might still be a little too grand for a convent. [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/dry.gif[/img]
[/quote]

Wow! That is gorgeous! Are those stairs leading up to the altar? And, I love the ceiling.

I'm definitely having to spend some time this weekend looking at pictures. I do love old buildings. Perhaps our convent can take over an older convent (although in the U.S., that limits us). But, in the Eastern U.S., maybe we could find something a few hundred years old.

I'd been thinking modern (without being stark or utilitarian) with a lot of the beauty coming from our physical surroundings. But, I need to try out some different ideas, too.

For example, for our refectory, the dining halls of a number of older universities in the U.S. would be lovely. (That's why I need all of you. I haven't visited a lot of (well, any) convents, so my examples of lovely buildings tend to be secular.)

Also, this gives me some ideas for the library. For example, the stacks where we keep the books in the library might be a little more modern (with temperature, humidity controls, etc.)--although with wood floors and bookshelves--we can have a lovely reading reading room with comfortable chairs/desks/tables (but not so comfortable that we fall asleep!)

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

[quote name='MaterMisericordiae' date='13 July 2010 - 10:25 PM' timestamp='1279077911' post='2142350']
That's a downside for me too. I like my room to retreat to and have silence. Hopefully, they have rules in the postulant dormitories that allow for silence so one can meditate and pray.
[/quote]

Mater--You're thinking in terms of visiting the Nashville Dominicans, so the dormitories are a real issue for you, and certainly something to ask about. Although, I think I have read somewhere about "study hall" for postulants. Also, I'm pretty sure (like most Orders) there is "grand silence" after the final prayers of the night. I think prayers finish early enough that Sisters have time to study, prepare lessons, etc. before "lights out." I'm sure you've already read the daily horarium on the Web site so you know this. Certainly, despite the lack of privacy, the postulant's dormitory is probably much quieter than any dorm! No IPods, TVs, stereos, etc.

From what I have read, it doesn't sound as if most monasteries in the U.S. have dormitories, that even the novitiate has cells. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.) However, the Motherhouse of the Nashville Dominicans used to be their boarding school (or at least parts of it were). And, when you look at the ND's Web site, it explains that the dormitories are in one of the oldest parts of the building.

Somehow, the dormitories at Nashville must work out, because, for example, the postulants typically attend Aquinas college, run by the Sisters--either to get their first degree, or, if they already have a teaching certificate, to take classes in how to teach "the Dominican way." For the novice year they don't attend school outside the Motherhouse. Then, after first profession, a Sister might go back to school to complete her degree, or, if she already has her teaching certificate, might do some teaching. It wasn't clear from the Web site how many years you might live in a dormitory.

However, even if dormitories work for others, I would have a very hard time living in a dormitory like the one the Nashville Dominicans have. But, everyone is different.

[krissylou]

[quote name='IgnatiusofLoyola' date='13 July 2010 - 10:51 PM' timestamp='1279075874' post='2142339']
However, the Dominican's refectory is a pretty stark white. Even some wood paneling at the windows would help make it look warmer. I'm not saying there should be a lot of "stuff" in the refectory--it should still be basically simple, if only because that makes it easier to keep clean. But I like the fact that the light fixtures in the Benedictine refectory are just a little different. What about a few plants in the refectory? In terms of decorating the walls, I think we may already be overrun with paintings and statues already. As much as I like St. Thomas, I can see someone suggesting that we put the all pictures of St. Thomas that didn't fit in the library onto the walls of the refectory. (My "secret" plan is that if someone tries to fill the library with pictures of St. Thomas, or plaster busts, one day everyone will find a different picture of St. Thomas in her cell. Vee8 gets the picture where St. Thomas is older, and doesn't look his best. (It will help remind her that it's going to happen to her, too, someday.) Note: Your pictures of libraries are gorgeous--I love them. But, they are way too big for the size of our community, and unfortunately they aren't practical. Gorgeous, but cold and damp. And, as much as I love books, I feel the chapel should be larger than the library.

[/quote]

I bow to your expertise on all things library-related ... but I do consider it kind of hilarious how much you're zooming in on being "practical" when this is all entirely imaginary.

Definite ix-nay on the plastic blinking lighted bleeding hearts of Jesus.

[TeresaBenedicta]

I've always wondering about the whole dormitory-style living vs. individual cells. I suppose it wouldn't really matter all that much to me-- it would depend on how much time was scheduled to be in your sleeping area. But I would imagine that if there were no "cells", there wouldn't be any time scheduled specifically for being in there and not sleeping.

At school I spent one year sharing a room and two years in a suite-style dorm, which let me have my own room. But in both cases, I rarely spent time in my room lest to sleep. Same here at home. I'm just never in there anyways. So, I suppose if I had dormitory-style living, I wouldn't be too bothered by it, because it would simply be the place I sleep. I'd pray, study, eat, etc elsewhere. And that's fine with me too.

[Hilde]

I personally think I would benefit from and enjoy a humble individual cell for solitude.

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

[quote name='Hilde' date='14 July 2010 - 12:40 PM' timestamp='1279129204' post='2142589']
I personally think I would benefit from and enjoy a humble individual cell for solitude.
[/quote]

I feel the same way. Plus, the idea of not having possession is attractive to me. If you don't own a lot of "stuff" your cell doesn't get messy. I would definitely want (and need) a quiet place to be alone even when I'm not sleeping.

FYI to Hilde on another subject--Although the pictures of various chapels we have been posting don't have Viking Boats hanging from the ceiling, the PPC main chapel definitely will have one.

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

[quote name='krissylou' date='14 July 2010 - 12:13 PM' timestamp='1279127586' post='2142574']
I bow to your expertise on all things library-related ... but I do consider it kind of hilarious how much you're zooming in on being "practical" when this is all entirely imaginary.

Definite ix-nay on the plastic blinking lighted bleeding hearts of Jesus. [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif[/img]
[/quote]

I've never pretended to make sense (even to myself). However:

--By nature I like to plan things (not everything, though). I don't usually like surprises--maybe because very few surprises in my life have been good ones. Some people like to look at the "big picture." I'm the one who likes to look at the details.

--I enjoy fantasy most if it is as close to real life as possible. Again, I don't pretend that that makes sense. But, it's probably the reason why, when I worked as a writer, I wrote nonfiction, and very detailed nonfiction at that. (But, then again, I wrote about the government, and that often is the biggest fantasy of all!)

--You'll notice that it is mostly the library where I am most thinking of details. Let someone else design the kitchen. I have a Master's in Library Science, where we learned to do things like design libraries. I think that kind of thing is fun, but in real life haven't gotten to do it enough.

But, be yourself, and think about and plan whatever makes you happy to think about. We need both kinds of people--those who think about the forest, and those who make sure that each of the trees in the forest is healthy.

Edited July 14, 2010 by IgnatiusofLoyola

[she_who_is_not]

In regard to the Nashville dormitories:
I've stayed in the dormitories while on retreat and will say that once the curtains are pulled around it is actually quite private and cozy. Sisters are not supposed to enter another sister's cell, except in case of emergency. We were asked to keep silence in the dorms and all the retreatants respected the silence. Girls who wanted to converse were allowed to stay in the parlor. I only had two complaints. One, the young lady next to me went to shower after lights out and left her lamp on. The white curtains amplify the light and I found it difficult to fall asleep. Also, the beds are all connected, so if a sleeper at the head of the row turns in her sleep the beds shake all the way down. It's kind of amusing for two nights, but I think it would become a real mortification after two years.

[ksterling]

The dorm situation at the NDs is one of the reasons I worry that I am too old for this. Despite my very best intentions, I don't think I could ever adjust to that.

[sistersintigo]

While looking for something completely different online,
I was surprised by a real estate listing for a property for sale in Cragmoor, New York.
A secluded hill/mountain estate that started out as a one-family retreat. Then, a fledgling congregation got hold of the estate and
attached a dormitory to the main house....before the congregation itself died out.
The group was known as "Daughters of Mary, Health of the Sick." Completely unfamiliar to me.
And this whole thing is now vacant and on the market, dormitory included.

[JTheresa]

The same thing happened to me. I was looking through pictures of convent for this thread and was surprised how many were listed for retail. It's really kind of sad. A lot of them are so big and beautiful. It looks like a few that were sold were urned turned into inns or something.

[vee]

I know it's sad to come across former monasteries being used for something secular or just plain empty. On the bright side in some places there are new ones being built such as the one I never shut up about Hey I'm just amazed at what gets built through the intercession of St Joseph
[img]http://landingconstruction.com/images/Carmel-St-Joseph_Monastery.jpg[/img]
under construction

[krissylou]

So. I think I want to be a PPC oblate.

I want to be part of the community in a significant sense, but I also want to live in the world.

Basically, more drawn to the idea of being in a secular institute or secular order than being a nun/Sister.

Oblates/tertiaries/whatevers are never ever supposed to wear a habit when out and about in the world, but some have a habit to be worn when gathered in community. That could be good.

So, I want to know if as an oblate/tertiary/whatever I would be able to enter the cloister or whether I could only have much contact with the uncloistered.

I want to be friends with and learn from ALL of you.

And go on retreat in a treehouse occasionally.

Krissylou, Obl.PPC

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

[quote name='krissylou' date='15 July 2010 - 11:33 AM' timestamp='1279211601' post='2142989']
So. I think I want to be a PPC oblate.

I want to be part of the community in a significant sense, but I also want to live in the world.

Basically, more drawn to the idea of being in a secular institute or secular order than being a nun/Sister.

Oblates/tertiaries/whatevers are never ever supposed to wear a habit when out and about in the world, but some have a habit to be worn when gathered in community. That could be good.

So, I want to know if as an oblate/tertiary/whatever I would be able to enter the cloister or whether I could only have much contact with the uncloistered.

I want to be friends with and learn from ALL of you.

And go on retreat in a treehouse occasionally. [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/P.gif[/img]

Krissylou, Obl.PPC
[/quote]

Krissylou--Although my first reaction to being an oblate was negative, I've changed my opinion 180 degrees. I am much more called to be an Oblate.

I need to read up some more, but I think Oblates in some communities wear habits, and enter the cloister, and are very much part of the community. So, that's what we will be. All of you warmed my heart the other day, and convinced me I belong, but to belong, means to be belong as myself, not as something God is not calling me to be, or as a "fake."

Unless someone strongly objects, you and I will wear habits, enter and live in the cloister, and be a full part of the community, but our vows will be different. However, our commitment to the Community will be just as strong as those who are called to be Brides of Christ for the rest of their lives.

I don't think I'm running away from something--I honestly think that God is not calling me to be a Bride of Christ. If it weren't for the fact that my illness has me largely confined to home, and, as my mother has reminded me, no man would want me anyway, I would actively look for a husband. Every single night I dream about a man falling in love with me (it's alway someone different, sometimes someone who I haven't seen for years--it's not one individual, and although it was often my ex for many years, it no longer is--I guess that's progress). I've long known that I don't look at the world the way most people do, so I've known I would have a harder time finding someone. But, I keep thinking that out of all the millions of men in the world, it must be possible that there is one man, just one, who sees the world in my unique way. Actually, I have met 4 or 5 men who do (and my ex-husband was not one of them)--and I'm not someone who believes we have only only soulmate. But, but in each case, when I met a man who loved and understood me, marriage was out of the question for various reasons.

When I was divorced, I was deeply hurt, and lost a part of myself, and after all these years that hurt is still fresh (although it has lessened over the years). I think that as much as I want to be a wife again, I am just as scared of married life as many of you are of religious life. Both are commitments for life, and I made one very stupid mistake, and since then, it's not that I don't trust other people, but I no longer trust my own judgement.

So, Krissylou, Oblates we will be. And, we will figure out what that means.

[JTheresa]

I like the Idea of you and Krissylou being oblates. You are an essential part of the PPC (heck, I'm pretty sure it was your idea in the first place ) and I am willing to imagine up any way that will make it work. Oblates sound like a wonderful idea, and you could certainly wear a habit if you wanted to!! I;m still trying to think of a way we could make the habit work for our may different charisms....


IDEA!!! Maybe we could all wear black ( or white. white seems more favorable but I know most of us are worried about our clumsy/klutziness. we could wear blue! or... NAVY! sorry, i really like navy. ) and then we could each wear a medallion (similar to the idea of the DSMMEs) that symbolizes our particular charism.

... at least, that's one idea.