Female Altar Servers

[fides quarens intellectum]

[quote name='the171' date='04 June 2010 - 06:17 PM' timestamp='1275693469' post='2123841']
and also im discerning the sisterhood.
[/quote]

All glory to God! Prayers during your discernment, and btw, to Phatmass! Be sure to check out the Vocation Station, if you haven't already.

Peace in Christ,
-fides

[Resurrexi]

Technically, altar servers are just replacements for men who have been ordained to the minor order of acolyte.

[CatherineM]

Married men can be ordained. They are ordained as permanent deacons, and occasionally as priests.

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='CatherineM' date='04 June 2010 - 06:53 PM' timestamp='1275695587' post='2123861']
Married men can be ordained. They are ordained as permanent deacons, and occasionally as priests.
[/quote]

w00t

[Brother Adam]

[quote name='fides quarens intellectum' date='04 June 2010 - 07:25 PM' timestamp='1275690328' post='2123821']
Brother Adam, by this line of thinking, would you also say it is not proper for married men to be altar servers? I am just curious.

(and I'm not trying to hijack this thread and turn it into a debate - i am genuinely curious as to what Brother Adam thinks).
[/quote]

It is better for someone enrolled in the order of acolyte to fulfill this role. Again, there is a liturgical loophole which allows anyone to serve as an altar server (not an acolyte), and a reader (not a lector), and an EM (rather than someone who is ordained or a consecrated virgin). Do I believe this loophole should be closed? Personally, yes, I believe the minor orders should be fully restored, porter on up. Do I believe it will happen, no. Do I tell people, such as girls that they are not allowed to be altar servers? No, of course not, the church allows them to be right now.

[Brother Adam]

As the letter linked above states:

From the point of view of liturgical law, an official interpretation of Canon 230, Paragraph 2, of the Code of Canon law on the possibility of delegating certain liturgical offices led to a 1994 letter from the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Sacraments clarifying that girls may serve at the altar. But bishops are not bound to permit them to do so, nor could the episcopal conference limit the bishop's faculty to decide for himself.

A further clarifying letter published in 2001 said priests are not compelled to have girls serve at the altar, even when their bishops grant permission.

The 1994 letter states: "It will always be very appropriate to follow the noble tradition of having boys serve at the altar. As is well known, this has led to a reassuring development of priestly vocations. Thus the obligation to support such groups of altar boys will always continue."

[CatherineM]

Here's something else to consider. It is easy to say that we would do without altar servers if we didn't use girls. That's the same thinking that has led to having a dozen extraordinary ministers. We can wait a few minutes longer for communion, and if they can only find one male to serve the altar, then that's okay too. We have some altar servers in their 70's. It doesn't have to just be boys.

[Resurrexi]

I think having porters at the doors of the church would be a lot cooler than having greeters and ushers*.



*Especially now that Usher (and thus all sharing the name or title) has been convicted of participating in the intolerable crime of helping to spread [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHzN80iC59I"]Bieber fever[/url].

Edited June 5, 2010 by Resurrexi

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='Brother Adam' date='04 June 2010 - 08:09 PM' timestamp='1275696580' post='2123873']
It is better for someone enrolled in the order of acolyte to fulfill this role. Again, there is a liturgical loophole which allows anyone to serve as an altar server (not an acolyte), and a reader (not a lector), and an EM (rather than someone who is ordained or a consecrated virgin). Do I believe this loophole should be closed? Personally, yes, I believe the minor orders should be fully restored, porter on up. Do I believe it will happen, no. Do I tell people, such as girls that they are not allowed to be altar servers? No, of course not, the church allows them to be right now.
[/quote]
[quote name='Resurrexi' date='04 June 2010 - 08:15 PM' timestamp='1275696937' post='2123878']
I think having porters at the doors of the church would be a lot cooler than having greeters and ushers*.



*Especially now that Usher (and thus all sharing the name or title) has been convicted of participating in the intolerable crime of helping to spread [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHzN80iC59I"]Bieber fever[/url].
[/quote]



I think they should reinstate the minor orders. Here's why:

1. I know some dioceses that skip the new lay ministries for the layity because it would mean discluding women from reading, etc, thus causing upheaval. Instead, they'll instate seminarians as acolytes and readers. It effectively became a substitution for the minor orders.

2. Porter is an awesome job. Honestly. Many saints were forced to be porters

3. At certain levels in the minor orders, one can bless (with a certain authority of the church, though not as profound as a priest's blessing) water, fruit and bread. This really points to the fact that the minor orders were layering on the responsibilities of the priest bit by bit by giving little bits of responsibility!


Okay. Rant over. Just the mumblings of a noob rad-trad who recently discovered the details in the minor orders...

[Hassan]

I think both sides have their merits and that all opinions laid out are worthy of respect.

Edited June 6, 2010 by Hassan

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='Hassan' date='05 June 2010 - 11:01 PM' timestamp='1275793268' post='2124427']
I think both sides have their merits and that all opinions laid out are worthy of respect.
[/quote]
You are truly one of the great debaters.

Edited June 6, 2010 by USAirwaysIHS

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='CatherineM' date='05 June 2010 - 01:15 AM' timestamp='1275696913' post='2123877']
Here's something else to consider. It is easy to say that we would do without altar servers if we didn't use girls. That's the same thinking that has led to having a dozen extraordinary ministers. We can wait a few minutes longer for communion, and if they can only find one male to serve the altar, then that's okay too. We have some altar servers in their 70's. It doesn't have to just be boys.
[/quote]
Very true. At daily Mass, the server is an older gentleman.

[HisChildForever]

I used to have an opinion of this subject, now I am more shrug/whatever. That is, one can say "there should be only male servers" and another can say "there should be both male and female servers" and I am whatever with both opinions. Anyway, I like what Catherine said - serving is not limited to children and teens. On my trip we had a priest (our fearless leader lol), a deacon, and a seminarian. The seminarian had been a lawyer for 25 years and had put off the call, so he was in his 40s I would say. He was our altar server when we said Mass, and got the job done fine.

[MithLuin]

When there are seminarians (who are acolytes) present, it would make sense to allow them to serve at the altar - regardless of age.

But regardless of the big picture of who the Church ought to be seeking out to fulfill these roles, the opening poster [i]doesn't want to[/i] - so she shouldn't. Helping out in a pinch is one thing, but she shouldn't volunteer/ sign up/ do it regularly, especially if she's not entirely comfortable with the scenario. One can express reluctance without explaining anything.

Not every young boy who is Catholic should be an altar server, right?

[jeffpugh]

No, they're also called to the schola