Cohabiting Couples To Be Refused The Eucharist?

[MithLuin]

My parents had pre-Cana waived, because they were living in different states (and getting married in a third). Their first year of marriage was difficult, so it probably would have been helpful if someone had sat them down and forced them to talk about some things.


In our diocese, couples generally have three choices. They can meet with the priest, they can attend a day long seminar or weekend (such as Engaged Encounter), or they can meet with a sponsor couple in their home 5 evenings about a month apart.

Some of the topics they discuss are spirituality, communication, finances, sex and kids, family of origin, etc. Basically, the idea is to make sure the couples have some clue of what marriage is, and get them talking about some of the more serious stuff.


When my parents (who are a sponsor couple) are talking to a couple who is co-habiting, they explain the problem with it in practical terms. Meaning, the conversation goes something like this:

When you're dating, you know that you have options. If it doesn't work out, you can leave. If you're living together, you can always move out on your own, go back to your parents, whatever. You're planning a wedding, but what is going to change? You'll get up in the morning, go to the church, have a party, and then....come back to the same house again. Nothing will have really changed, so when problems come along, what's going to make you think that option isn't still there? What is going to make those vows real?

No one who is getting married wants to get divorced. If you can explain to a couple [i]why[/i] living together before marriage leads to a divorce mentality, they'll be more amenable when you suggest alternatives. Even if moving out isn't practical, the couple can at least sleep separately until the wedding, so then the wedding will [i]mean[/i] something. Something will have changed, and being married will be different than what came before.

Not everyone buys into this argument, either, but I think this approach is very pastoral. If done within a context of helping a couple to begin a good marriage and talking about what love actually means, it can be a good conversation. Some couples are more interested in spiritual stuff than others, but they've all opted to get married in the Church. So, you have a chance to talk about some theology/philosophy.

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='tinytherese' date='28 May 2010 - 04:48 PM' timestamp='1275079691' post='2119829']
"Christ takes the water of our courtship and turns it into the wine of married life."
[/quote]

This is win.

[MissScripture]

[quote name='MithLuin' date='28 May 2010 - 10:41 PM' timestamp='1275100886' post='2119975']
My parents had pre-Cana waived, because they were living in different states (and getting married in a third). Their first year of marriage was difficult, so it probably would have been helpful if someone had sat them down and forced them to talk about some things.


[b]In our diocese, couples generally have three choices. They can meet with the priest, they can attend a day long seminar or weekend (such as Engaged Encounter), or they can meet with a sponsor couple in their home 5 evenings about a month apart.[/b]

Some of the topics they discuss are spirituality, communication, finances, sex and kids, family of origin, etc. Basically, the idea is to make sure the couples have some clue of what marriage is, and get them talking about some of the more serious stuff.


When my parents (who are a sponsor couple) are talking to a couple who is co-habiting, they explain the problem with it in practical terms. Meaning, the conversation goes something like this:

When you're dating, you know that you have options. If it doesn't work out, you can leave. If you're living together, you can always move out on your own, go back to your parents, whatever. You're planning a wedding, but what is going to change? You'll get up in the morning, go to the church, have a party, and then....come back to the same house again. Nothing will have really changed, so when problems come along, what's going to make you think that option isn't still there? What is going to make those vows real?

No one who is getting married wants to get divorced. If you can explain to a couple [i]why[/i] living together before marriage leads to a divorce mentality, they'll be more amenable when you suggest alternatives. Even if moving out isn't practical, the couple can at least sleep separately until the wedding, so then the wedding will [i]mean[/i] something. Something will have changed, and being married will be different than what came before.

Not everyone buys into this argument, either, but I think this approach is very pastoral. If done within a context of helping a couple to begin a good marriage and talking about what love actually means, it can be a good conversation. Some couples are more interested in spiritual stuff than others, but they've all opted to get married in the Church. So, you have a chance to talk about some theology/philosophy.
[/quote]
In our diocese, you have to do all three, unless the priest decides something different (such as, my hubby and I did not meet with a sponsor couple, because we lived 6 hours away). But you get like $100 off the marriage license price in MN if you have proof of taking marrige prep classes, which they should've mentioned to people at the beginning of the weekend, instead of the end, because then maybe some of the people would've stopped whining about having to be there.

I don't really remember if they talked about cohabitation during the marriage prep weekend, because it didn't apply to me.

[JustJump]

Curious, Catherine M...so you were married legally but not yet in the Church. Assuming you waited until you were married in the Church for any "co-habiting", why did you not recieve communion?

Edited May 29, 2010 by JustJump

[N/A Gone]

In America the only sexual misconduct we punish is homosexuality. Divorce is ok, pre-marital sexual relationships is ok, we arrest pedo's but then glorify the concept in most of the media, but we really go after the homosexuals. Jesus loves you, as long as you do not love men.



(Do not take me too literal, I am mostly just frustrated.)

Edited May 29, 2010 by Revprodeji

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Revprodeji' date='29 May 2010 - 03:49 PM' timestamp='1275166176' post='2120306']
In America the only sexual misconduct we punish is homosexuality. Divorce is ok, pre-marital sexual relationships is ok, we arrest pedo's but then glorify the concept in most of the media, but we really go after the homosexuals.



(Do not take me too literal, I am mostly just frustrated)
[/quote]
I understand that you don't mean this to be taken strictly literally, but how is pedophilia possibly glorified in the media? My personal impression is that the majority of people consider it to be completely unforgivable no matter what.

[N/A Gone]

Ever watch music videos or movies?

Miley Cyrus?
A younger Brit Spears and Christina?
The numerous shows that have "teen" girls engaging in sexual activity.
The fashion of teen age girls.

It is a weird thing but we look down on those who engage in those acts, but we seem to glorify the idea of a sexual minor female. As a teacher (and older brother) this is utterly disquesting.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Revprodeji' date='29 May 2010 - 04:58 PM' timestamp='1275170296' post='2120338']
Ever watch music videos or movies?

Miley Cyrus?
A younger Brit Spears and Christina?
The numerous shows that have "teen" girls engaging in sexual activity.
The fashion of teen age girls.

It is a weird thing but we look down on those who engage in those acts, but we seem to glorify the idea of a sexual minor female. As a teacher (and older brother) this is utterly disquesting.
[/quote]
Oh, ok. I see what you're getting at then. Yea, I'd have to agree in that case.

[CatherineM]

[quote name='JustJump' date='29 May 2010 - 12:49 PM' timestamp='1275155379' post='2120220']
Curious, Catherine M...so you were married legally but not yet in the Church. Assuming you waited until you were married in the Church for any "co-habiting", why did you not recieve communion?
[/quote]
We didn't "co-habitate" until we were legally married. Had we just legally married, but not co-habitated until our marriage was blessed by the church, I would have been deported. Canadian Immigration is very complicated, and they are constantly looking for people who are defrauding the system. Some people will pay a Canadian to marry them so that they can come to Canada. As soon as they get residency, they divorce and sponsor their real wives from back home. Some Canadians are tricked into marrying someone who says they love them, only to disappear when they fly in. Because of this, Canadian Immigration officers are required to ask questions that under any other circumstances would be an invasion of privacy. I had to learn all the names of his extended family members, we had to be able to identify scars or other distinguishing marks on each other's bodies. We had to answer really personal questions about our intimate lives together. Had we tried to say that we were waiting to sleep together until after our priest blessed our marriage, I would have been charged with immigration fraud, and gone to jail. Canada used to have a fiance visa program like the US does, but had to end it because too many people were coming over and then not getting married, but staying in the country illegally. Again, we could have taken a hard line, but I think we would have gotten crushed.

[Catholic Fox]

That's no good.

[CatherineM]

[quote name='Catholic Fox' date='29 May 2010 - 05:43 PM' timestamp='1275173028' post='2120357']
That's no good.
[/quote]
Life is often a compromise. We weighed our options, we made our decision, and lived with the consequences. It helped that our priest understood why we had chosen to marry legally first.

[IgnatiusofLoyola]

[quote name='CatherineM' date='29 May 2010 - 06:16 PM' timestamp='1275175007' post='2120370']
Life is often a compromise. We weighed our options, we made our decision, and lived with the consequences. It helped that our priest understood why we had chosen to marry legally first.
[/quote]

Wow, both a MIL with mental health issues (to understate the case) and then having to deal with Canadian immigration. I had a co-worker from Denmark, who married an American, and the loops they had to jump through to prove that they married for love, not to let her live in the U.S. were also very invasive of their privacy. She even brought in their letters to each other to show that they had been dating for a couple of years before they got married.

You must have really loved this guy. LOL (That's been obvious in all your posts.)

[CatherineM]

[quote name='IgnatiusofLoyola' date='29 May 2010 - 08:42 PM' timestamp='1275183737' post='2120452']
Wow, both a MIL with mental health issues (to understate the case) and then having to deal with Canadian immigration. I had a co-worker from Denmark, who married an American, and the loops they had to jump through to prove that they married for love, not to let her live in the U.S. were also very invasive of their privacy. She even brought in their letters to each other to show that they had been dating for a couple of years before they got married.

You must have really loved this guy. LOL (That's been obvious in all your posts.)
[/quote]
I'm absolutely nuts about him. We had to copy 400 pages worth of emails and letters to send in with my application for residency. I truly hope no one actually read them. I still have nightmares about them ending up on the internet or something.

[southern california guy]

My dad was complaining about a Eucharistic server -- who was living with his girlfriend. I'll have to ask him more details.

[mommas_boy]

[quote name='CatherineM' date='27 May 2010 - 06:43 PM' timestamp='1275000189' post='2119355']
Malta's hardcore. I wish we could all do that. I wonder if it is easier there because it's an island and everyone kind of knows each other. In a place like Edmonton where everyone is from somewhere else, it can be harder to know without giving every new parishioner the third degree.
[/quote]

Forgive me, forgive me, forgive me ... but where I come from, some of our bishops have problems with denying the eucharist to Catholics in a state of [b]public[/b] mortal sin, let alone "private" sin. *cough* Nancy Pelosi *cough*

Edited May 30, 2010 by mommas_boy