CatherineM Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 I truly believe in looking at the fruits. In my experience the fruits of this renewal/theology/association, whatever you want to call it, have been unfortunate to truly bad. Others have other experiences I'm sure, but the Charismatics took half my family out of the Church. I don't consider that to be good for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 26, 2010 Author Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote name='CatherineM' date='26 May 2010 - 02:39 PM' timestamp='1274906346' post='2118422'] I truly believe in looking at the fruits. In my experience the fruits of this renewal/theology/association, whatever you want to call it, have been unfortunate to truly bad. Others have other experiences I'm sure, but the Charismatics took half my family out of the Church. I don't consider that to be good for them. [/quote] My experiences have been similar to yours. Moreover, as a former Protestant I have found the Catholic pentecostal movement to be theologically impoverished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selah Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 I have to say, in certain rites, like the Latin Rite, it probably would not work. I also don't really feel comfortable with the idea of it happening during Mass. It just doesn't fit. So... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sacredheartandbloodofjesus Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 (edited) [quote name='CatherineM' date='26 May 2010 - 03:39 PM' timestamp='1274906346' post='2118422'] I truly believe in looking at the fruits. In my experience the fruits of this renewal/theology/association, whatever you want to call it, have been unfortunate to truly bad. Others have other experiences I'm sure, but the Charismatics took half my family out of the Church. I don't consider that to be good for them. [/quote] No, those family members weak faith or ignorance of the Faith in the Church and its teachings took them out of the Church not the Renewal. If I took this outlook of yours, the Latin Mass is not good because it "took out" a large part of the Church from full communion. But I do not adopt this outlook. Edited May 26, 2010 by sacredheartandbloodofjesus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePenciledOne Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote name='Apotheoun' date='26 May 2010 - 05:38 PM' timestamp='1274906298' post='2118421'] Perhaps you should refrain from quoting Fr. Walsh, since - as odd as it sounds - you and he do not agree on this topic. He clearly has no problem using the word "Pentecostalism." [/quote] Have you ever read his book? Never said, I don't agree with him I actually do. I am not afraid of using the word. You on the other hand are using it in a loaded and slanted question I feel and if nothing else this poll will create more division, which I don't feel that phatmass needs. So I will retract my vote. Most people on here know where I stand anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 26, 2010 Author Share Posted May 26, 2010 (edited) [quote name='Selah' date='26 May 2010 - 02:44 PM' timestamp='1274906647' post='2118424'] I also don't really feel comfortable with the idea of it happening during Mass. It just doesn't fit. [/quote] I have been to pentecostal/charismatic masses were people spoke in tongues and received "words of knowledge" (after which some members of the congregation said: "The word of the Lord" and "Thanks be to God"), and I felt quite uncomfortable. Edited May 26, 2010 by Apotheoun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 26, 2010 Author Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote name='ThePenciledOne' date='26 May 2010 - 02:47 PM' timestamp='1274906840' post='2118428'] Have you ever read his book? Never said, I don't agree with him I actually do. I am not afraid of using the word. You on the other hand are using it in a loaded and slanted question I feel and if nothing else this poll will create more division, which I don't feel that phatmass needs. So I will retract my vote. Most people on here know where I stand anyway. [/quote] Several years ago when I was studying at FUS for my MA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selah Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote]I have been to pentecostal/charismatic masses were people spoke in tongues and received "words of knowledge" (after which some members of the congregation said: "The word of the Lord" and "Thanks be to God"), and I felt quite uncomfortable. [/quote] But see, if you are receving the Eucharist, you shouldn't be yacking...you should be silent. Maybe in private, but Mass doesn't seem like the right place for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 26, 2010 Author Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote name='Selah' date='26 May 2010 - 02:52 PM' timestamp='1274907123' post='2118432'] But see, if you are receving the Eucharist, you shouldn't be yacking...you should be silent. Maybe in private, but Mass doesn't seem like the right place for it. [/quote] I agree. What a person does during private prayer is between him and God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iheartjp2 Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 I voted "No" because I believe the term "pentecostalism" to be demeaning, deceptive, and altogether uncharitable. I support the Charismatic Renewal in the Church as it has been tolerated, if not approved, by the Church for the past 30 some years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fides quarens intellectum Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 (edited) Sorry, Apo - I didn't vote b/c I wasn't sure what you meant by "Pentacostalism." I didn't realize you were possibly going for Catholic Charismatic Renewal (?). If, though, on second thought, you were referring to "Pentacostalism" in light of Pope John 23's prayer for the Second Vatican Council, I guess I should have voted "yes." oh, well. Edited May 26, 2010 by fides quarens intellectum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 26, 2010 Author Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote name='fides quarens intellectum' date='26 May 2010 - 03:04 PM' timestamp='1274907878' post='2118440'] Sorry, Apo - I didn't vote b/c I wasn't sure what you meant by "Pentacostalism." I didn't realize you were possibly going for Catholic Charismatic Renewal (?). If, though, on second thought, you were referring to "Pentacostalism" in light of Pope John 23's prayer for the Second Vatican Council, I guess I should have voted "yes." oh, well. [/quote] I am sorry that you were unable to vote. Clearly Fr. Walsh, a prominent member of this movement, is unaware of the fact that the term "pentecostalism" is offensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sacredheartandbloodofjesus Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote name='Apotheoun' date='26 May 2010 - 04:08 PM' timestamp='1274908128' post='2118449'] I am sorry that you were unable to vote. Clearly Fr. Walsh, a prominent member of this movement, is unaware of the fact that the term "pentecostalism" is offensive. [/quote] Its not offensive but it can be misleading when not taken in context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 26, 2010 Author Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote name='sacredheartandbloodofjesus' date='26 May 2010 - 03:15 PM' timestamp='1274908559' post='2118462'] Its not offensive but it can be misleading when not taken in context. [/quote] I am using the term in exactly the same way as Fr. Walsh. Perhaps PTO should not quote him as a source of information any longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fides quarens intellectum Posted May 26, 2010 Share Posted May 26, 2010 [quote name='Apotheoun' date='26 May 2010 - 04:08 PM' timestamp='1274908128' post='2118449'] I am sorry that you were unable to vote. Clearly Fr. Walsh, a prominent member of this movement, is unaware of the fact that the term "pentecostalism" is offensive. [/quote] okay - i am trying to "catch up" via the other thread you referenced. sorry - i'll go back to my little corner now. proceed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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