Do You Give To Beggars?

[CatherineM]

[quote name='IgnatiusofLoyola' date='17 May 2010 - 02:50 PM' timestamp='1274125826' post='2112034']
In Chicago, we have a newspaper called Streetwise that is sold by homeless people, published by an organization that helps the homeless. The vendors have to register and wear an identity necklace so you know they are authorized vendors.

Whenever I see someone selling the magazine, I buy it, even if I already have that issue. And, I give the seller an extra dollar or two more than the price. The vendors are not allowed to ask for extra money (and I have never had one ask), but they are allowed to accept extra money if you give it.

I figure that when I give money to a Streetwise vendor, I'm giving it to someone who is really trying to make their situation better. It's not easy for them to stand outside in all weathers, selling a newspaper. By selling a newspaper, it gives them more dignity than simply begging.

I do this in addition to "official" giving to charities.

That could easily be me someday.
[/quote]
We have one of those papers as well, and we always buy it.

[BG45]

I only give out food, never money. You can always tell what they want the money for when you do that; I had one guy who was truly grateful once, and another in Cincinatti that cussed me a blue streak and threw the food across a sidewalk because it wasn't cash.

[T-Bone _]

McDonald's gift cards are a good choice.

[Era Might]

[quote name='Raphael' date='17 May 2010 - 12:33 PM' timestamp='1274114034' post='2111918']I usually avoid it just because you never know...some towns have outlawed begging or assisting beggars and it could be a sting. Sometimes a "beggar" turns out to be offering "services." It's just too risky. Send them to a shelter or a church.
[/quote]
Yes. As the Sermon on the Mount and the Great Commission say, "Go ye therefore and send the poor to shelters and churches...but whatever you do don't risk your own life or money!"

Sorry for the sarcasm. I'm not being sarcastic toward you personally, but to the sentiment you are reflecting in your post, a sentiment which I honestly find completely contrary to the Gospel. But it is a sentiment that is deeply ingrained in our society.

As for towns that have outlawed begging or assisting beggars, I would reject any such law, and I would gladly be arrested in defiance of any such law.

Edited May 17, 2010 by Era Might

[Ephrem Augustine]

I never carry cash on me. For good or worse.

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='17 May 2010 - 12:13 PM' timestamp='1274116439' post='2111950']
Seems like a better idea to me to pick a solid local organization and donate to them, then refer those guys there.
[/quote]

I used to have those on hand... Sometimes they can sort out the honest folks that can use a little help, from those who know how to work the system.

[quote name='CatherineM' date='17 May 2010 - 12:21 PM' timestamp='1274116878' post='2111955']
No. If you ask people who work at homeless shelters they will tell you to never give money. It's for two reasons. Giving them money enables them to go one more day without seeking help. It also can set them up to believe they are entitled to the money making them aggressive. I donate my time and money to groups that offer help and hope to the homeless instead.

I have given money to a beggar only once since I've been in Edmonton. A guy at the bus stop wanted money for the bus to go to the hospital. He showed me his obviously dislocated shoulder. I gave him the bus money. I saw him a few days later showing the dislocated shoulder to another pigeon. I guess he can pop it in and out at will. Pretty good trick.
[/quote]

There are stories that circulate.
I used to go to Sunday Mass at one parish, I went to weekday mass at another (close to community college), and another one for confession and adoration on saturdays. I swore there was a guy I saw frequently at all the parishes looking for money.
The last time I saw him was the time a friend's wallet got stolen.
There are several religious houses in our neighborhood, and I guess there are some guys who make the rounds to the different religious houses. Sometimes a guy comes to the same place with the same story. Unfortunately our religious house doesn't have competent social workers, it is for students. Sometimes we offer to make a sandwich and often times they are gone by the time we come back to give it to them.

[quote name='T-Bone _' date='17 May 2010 - 03:26 PM' timestamp='1274127981' post='2112087']
McDonald's gift cards are a good choice.
[/quote]

Who has a mcdonald's card on hand though? Actually that is a good idea.

Really, i think the important thing we should be asking is our attitude toward a homeless person. We can or cannot give them money, and maybe we give it to them out of naivete, or withhold it out of complete bitter disgust. Niave person might need to toughen up a little and learn to say NO, and disgusted arrogant person might need to learn some compassion.

[rhetoricfemme]

[quote name='CatherineM' date='17 May 2010 - 01:21 PM' timestamp='1274116878' post='2111955']
No. If you ask people who work at homeless shelters they will tell you to never give money. It's for two reasons. Giving them money enables them to go one more day without seeking help. It also can set them up to believe they are entitled to the money making them aggressive. I donate my time and money to groups that offer help and hope to the homeless instead.
[/quote]
It never crossed my mind that giving someone money is acting as an enabler... I'll have to remember that. But yes, donating to homeless shelters and other helpful organizations wonderful.

[quote name='IgnatiusofLoyola' date='17 May 2010 - 03:50 PM' timestamp='1274125826' post='2112034']
In Chicago, we have a newspaper called Streetwise that is sold by homeless people, published by an organization that helps the homeless. The vendors have to register and wear an identity necklace so you know they are authorized vendors.

Whenever I see someone selling the magazine, I buy it, even if I already have that issue. And, I give the seller an extra dollar or two more than the price. The vendors are not allowed to ask for extra money (and I have never had one ask), but they are allowed to accept extra money if you give it.

I figure that when I give money to a Streetwise vendor, I'm giving it to someone who is really trying to make their situation better. It's not easy for them to stand outside in all weathers, selling a newspaper. By selling a newspaper, it gives them more dignity than simply begging.

I do this in addition to "official" giving to charities.

That could easily be me someday.
[/quote]
What a wonderful concept!

[quote name='Ephrem Augustine' date='17 May 2010 - 04:54 PM' timestamp='1274129674' post='2112155']
Who has a mcdonald's card on hand though? Actually that is a good idea.

ally,Re i think the important thing we should be asking is our attitude toward a homeless person. We can or cannot give them money, and maybe we give it to them out of naivete, or withhold it out of complete bitter disgust. Niave person might need to toughen up a little and learn to say NO, and disgusted arrogant person might need to learn some compassion.
[/quote]
I've thought about buying $20 worth of McDonald's or Subway gift cards before... We have a couple of homeless people near our local shopping center, and there's plenty of fast food around there.

I'm not beyond giving money, but I prefer giving food or drink when I have it on hand. I try to keep bottled water in my car for the few regular folks I see, and if I go shopping and they're out I'll buy crackers or something to give to them. With my luck though, they're usually gone by the time I get out of the store.

Keeping granola bars on hand is a great idea, though!

[princessgianna]

Never money, if I have it I will give them food.

My Mom's friend complied a list of various food pantry names with their location and phone number on a business sized card and will give that out to beggers. She has commented on how interesting it is how many "beggers" refuse and will give it right back disgusted!!! Really makes you wonder....

[CatherineM]

[quote name='Era Might' date='17 May 2010 - 03:35 PM' timestamp='1274128511' post='2112109']
As for towns that have outlawed begging or assisting beggars, I would reject any such law, and I would gladly be arrested in defiance of any such law.
[/quote]
Head to St. Pete, Florida then. They have outlawed asking for money in the downtown core, and are trying to pass a law to cover the entire city.

[mommas_boy]

Food, bus passes, clothing only. Never cash.

ETA: The only time I gave money was to Streetwise vendors in Chicago when I lived there, and also to random people selling socks or flowers at the underpasses in Chicago. I figure that they are trying to make a living and pull themselves up through their labors.

Edited May 17, 2010 by mommas_boy

[princessgianna]

[quote name='mommas_boy' date='17 May 2010 - 04:42 PM' timestamp='1274132525' post='2112225']
Food, bus passes, clothing only. Never cash.

ETA: The only time I gave money was to Streetwise vendors in Chicago when I lived there, and also to random people selling socks or flowers at the underpasses in Chicago. I figure that they are trying to make a living and pull themselves up through their labors.
[/quote]
Yea I don't mind helping people who are trying to make an honest living. I find that rather admirable.

[AccountDeleted]

I have to admit that I don't respond the same way every time so I am probably unconsciously responding to what I feel from each individual person. If I have spare change in my pocket, I might hand it over if I truly think they are needy, but I won't take out my wallet and open it in front of someone. If I have food, then yes, I will offer that.

But since I have been mostly unemployed since I got back to Australia and haven't had a lot of spare money to hand out, I will often just say that I have nothing to give but would be happy to pray with them. I have had various responses to this as well. One guy told me aggressively that he didn't believe in God and I told him that God believed in him and I would pray for him.

One girl was a regular outside a particular grocery store, sitting on the ground with a sign in front of her, so I used to go and sit with her and talk to her about her situation. One day I saw her in another suburb, walking the street, so I called out to her (she had told me her name) and gave her a little change - she was filthy from head to toe and I always wanted to take her home and get her cleaned up, but I didn't have my own place to do this. so we would just pray togetherr.

Another time I was with my brother when we were approached so I offered to pray for this fellow, who was with a couple of his friends at the time. He looked shocked but said yes, so we held hands and I prayed aloud for him and afterwards he seemed incredibly touched and thanked me very sincerely. He and his friends left then and my brother (an agnostic) turned me and said he was touched as well.

To one street beggar, I responded that, like Sts Peter and John in front of the temple, I had nothing to offer but prayers, and this fellow said that they didn't just pray for the beggar, they healed the man. It was my turn to be surprised and I said "You know the Bible!" and he smiled and we talked about scripture for awhile and I found out that he knew quite a lot but had lost faith. Although I am not a healer and this man wasn't in need of any physical healing, I hope that God healed his heart a little that day.

Sometimes just being able to acknowledge a person and speak with them can make them feel loved by God, and that is much better than giving them money or even food, since our souls are fed by God's love. Yes, it can be dangerous to speak with strangers, so one might need to gauge their time and place - perhaps not a dark alley at night in NYC ? But whenever we can treat each other with love, I know that it must be pleasing to God and so much more valuable to a beggar than even they realize.

[Norseman82]

[quote name='Era Might' date='17 May 2010 - 04:35 PM' timestamp='1274128511' post='2112109']
Yes. As the Sermon on the Mount and the Great Commission say, "Go ye therefore and send the poor to shelters and churches...but whatever you do don't risk your own life or money!"

Sorry for the sarcasm. I'm not being sarcastic toward you personally, but to the sentiment you are reflecting in your post, a sentiment which I honestly find completely contrary to the Gospel. But it is a sentiment that is deeply ingrained in our society.

[/quote]

Christ called us to be loving, not naive and stupid. Besides, a shelter may be able to help them out a lot more than throwing a buck at them.

You want to know something? It's more of a sacrifice for me to go take 5 minutes and risk missing my train to actually take a homeless person into a food place and buy him a sandwich. But I guess that doesn't fit into naive 15-second soundbite or 1960s hippie Christianity.

Besides, the Didache did say something about knowing where your charity is going.

Edited May 18, 2010 by Norseman82

[Era Might]

[quote name='Norseman82' date='17 May 2010 - 09:58 PM' timestamp='1274147902' post='2112408']
Christ called us to be loving, not naive and stupid. Besides, a shelter may be able to help them out a lot more than throwing a buck at them.

You want to know something? It's more of a sacrifice for me to go take 5 minutes and risk missing my train to actually take a homeless person into a food place and buy him a sandwich. But I guess that doesn't fit into naive 15-second soundbite or 1960s hippie Christianity.

Besides, the Didache did say something about knowing where your charity is going.
[/quote]
My point was not about whether or not to always give money. If you want to pass a beggar off to an institution, okay...but in doing so, you're likely missing the point of the Gospel. Beggars bother us precisely because we don't know what to do when we encounter them...so we pass them off to institutions, instead of (as the Gospel invites us to do) responding to an immediate opportunity for personal relationship that arises when we encounter a beggar.

"Throwing a buck at them" is irrelevant. The point of charity is relationship, not "services." Institutions feed the hungry to solve a social problem; that is, to render professional services. But Christians are supposed to feed the hungry, not because we are trying to solve hunger as a social problem, but because in encountering a hungry person, we are encountering Christ (and the hungry person is encountering Christ in us).

If you don't want to give them money, okay. But don't pass the beggar off to an institution and then expect them to see you, not as a person, but as nothing more than an institutional representative. Is a dollar what a beggar always needs? Of course not. Sometimes they just need someone to listen. Sometimes they need someone to give them advice. Sometimes they just need someone to notice them. But at all times they need people to take them seriously (whatever their problems are), to treat them as people and not as clients for a "charitable institution."

We should indeed know where our charity is going. It's going to die because instead of charity being a personal act of relationship, it becomes an institutional act of professional services.

Edited May 18, 2010 by Era Might

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Era Might' date='17 May 2010 - 11:14 PM' timestamp='1274148870' post='2112411']
My point was not about whether or not to always give money. If you want to pass a beggar off to an institution, okay...but in doing so, you're likely missing the point of the Gospel. Beggars bother us precisely because we don't know what to do when we encounter them...so we pass them off to institutions, instead of (as the Gospel invites us to do) responding to an immediate opportunity for personal relationship that arises when we encounter a beggar.

"Throwing a buck at them" is irrelevant. The point of charity is relationship, not "services." Institutions feed the hungry to solve a social problem; that is, to render professional services. But Christians are supposed to feed the hungry because in encountering that hungry person, we are encountering Christ (and the hungry person is encountering Christ in us).

If you don't want to give them money, okay. But don't pass the beggar off to an institution and then expect them to see you, not as a person, but as nothing more than an institutional representative. Is a dollar what a beggar always needs? Of course not. Sometimes they just need someone to listen. Sometimes they need someone to give them advice. Sometimes they just need someone to notice them. But at all times they need people to take them seriously (whatever their problems are), to treat them as people and not as clients for a "charitable institution."

We should indeed know where our charity is going. It's going to die because instead of charity being a personal act of relationship, it becomes an institutional act of professional services.
[/quote]
My daughter when she worked in Pittsburgh knew all the beggers by sight. She handed out food, but attached info about the local homeless shelter and job applications as well.

[Norseman82]

[quote name='Era Might' date='17 May 2010 - 10:14 PM' timestamp='1274148870' post='2112411']
My point was not about whether or not to always give money. If you want to pass a beggar off to an institution, okay...but in doing so, you're likely missing the point of the Gospel. Beggars bother us precisely because we don't know what to do when we encounter them...so we pass them off to institutions, instead of (as the Gospel invites us to do) responding to an immediate opportunity for personal relationship that arises when we encounter a beggar.

"Throwing a buck at them" is irrelevant. The point of charity is relationship, not "services." Institutions feed the hungry to solve a social problem; that is, to render professional services. But Christians are supposed to feed the hungry, not because we are trying to solve hunger as a social problem, but because in encountering a hungry person, we are encountering Christ (and the hungry person is encountering Christ in us).

If you don't want to give them money, okay. But don't pass the beggar off to an institution and then expect them to see you, not as a person, but as nothing more than an institutional representative. Is a dollar what a beggar always needs? Of course not. Sometimes they just need someone to listen. Sometimes they need someone to give them advice. Sometimes they just need someone to notice them. But at all times they need people to take them seriously (whatever their problems are), to treat them as people and not as clients for a "charitable institution."

We should indeed know where our charity is going. It's going to die because instead of charity being a personal act of relationship, it becomes an institutional act of professional services.
[/quote]

Yeah, well, maybe the "institution" I am "passing them off to" can do a better job of helping them than me. And at the end of the day, isn't getting the job done the important thing?