Livin_the_MASS Posted April 13, 2004 Share Posted April 13, 2004 I seen that I have gotten introuble the other day. I have also seen that Bruce was suspended for sometime. I am sad at this, I know me and him went back and forth a little bit, and I am sorry for my lack of charity to all the phatmassers. I took yesterday to pray and think. I'm sure many of you are aware of a book called "The Imitation of Christ." Well there is also one called the "Imitation of Mary" During my process of prayer I came across this and I would like to share it with you guys. "Submission To God's Will Even In What Seems Contrary To His Glory" "The Believer" "Mother of Jesus, what sorrow you felt at seeing the Jews draw little profit from your Divine Son's preaching! That heavenly teaching, although accredited by miracles, could not convert so many stubborn minds that preferred to blind themselves. Like sick men who push away the hand that wants to heal them, these unbelieving men rejected the salvation offered them. "What were your feeling then? You groaned at the blindness and stubbornness of these headstrong people, but you groaned in silence and never stopped praying God for their conversion. [color=blue]"Mary" "My child, the thing I certainly wanted above all else was for Jesus to be known. My zeal for His glory made me feel deeply the hardening of Jewish hearts. Yet why should I have therefore lost my peace of soul? "I knew God often makes use of evil in carrying out His plans; I knew He draws good from evil. Therefore in silence I adored the infinite wisdom that at times allows wickedness to triumph.[/color] "The Believer" "Holy Virgin, that patience will be my model in all circumstances of life and especially in those in which my faith will feel itself shaken. [color=blue]"Mary"[/color] [color=blue][b]"Yes, my child, when you see wickedness walking happily with head held high and trampling innocence down, do not let yourself be swept along by impulses of an embittered zeal.[/b] [b]True religious spirit forbids such a course.[/b][/color] [color=blue][b][u]"Why can you not bear with what God Himself accepts?[/u][/b] He could prevent what you regard scandalous, but He does not do so and He has His reasons. It is for you to adore them.[/color] [color=blue]"Nothing happens in our world without His permission. And everything, evil as well as good, serves His providential purposes. It is not granted to you now to understand His plans but the day will come when you will recognize their full justice and wisdom.[/color] "[color=blue]You should not, of course, be insensible of the evils in the Church; it is only right that they should be a source of affliction for you; [b]you may even weep bitterly over them, as God Himself does.[/b] [b]But if you were to be scandalized at them so that your faith suffered of you lost your peace, that would not any longer be zeal but an abuse and excess.[/b][/color] [color=blue]"One true virtue does not destroy another. Submission of mind to what God allows is compatible with genuine zeal fo the glory of God. "Evils call for your tears and laments, but they should be tears shed at the Savior's feet and laments voiced to Him. "Tell Him of your anguish; ask Him to put an end to your afflictions; speak to Him with a holy freedom. He will not be offended.[/color] [color=red]"Awake, O Lord. Why do You sleep? Rise up and do not abandon us forever. Why do You hide Your face and continue to ignore our misery and our sufferings?" (PS 44: 24-25)[/color] [color=blue][b]"It is You that men dare declare war; it is Your holy name that is scorned, Your religion that is blasphemed, Your work that men seek to destroy! Defend Your cause. Do not let evil prevail any longer, for it is Your very glory that is at stake.[/b] "My child, if you address Him in this fashion, you will do justice to what zeal for God's glory and your religion requires, and you will be able to wait in peace for the Lord to come and console you."[/color] So forgive me of not putting my zeal more in check, I promise with the help and grace of God to do better. I was upset at first but Dust is right. I was wrong lacking in charity. Especially because I am a Catholic Christian I should be able to show this to my brothers and sisters in Christ, even If I'm getting spite in the face. [color=red]Matthew 18:4 "Whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven"[/color] [b]I need to be more humble![/b] Dust I ask you this question because I want to help, not to be a problem. I know you have said before "debunk the issue" I think? I try to do this but it seems that when someone has an accusion against us and we or I give an answer, it is like it was never given or typed out. How do you adress the issue in a charitable manner when pictures are shown with statements. I ask this for advise because I'm sure it will happen again in the future. Some of it is me I take a post personal and let it get the best of me. I am sorry for letting that happen. I apologize to whom ever I have been uncharitable to. I will try better next time. God Bless Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livin_the_MASS Posted April 14, 2004 Author Share Posted April 14, 2004 bump for dust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Friday Posted April 14, 2004 Share Posted April 14, 2004 Jason, once dUSt answers your question, can I have your permission to change the title of this thread to "The Imitation of Mary & Charity," lock it, and pin it? I think it needs to be right at the top of the Debate Table for all to see that, in order to imitate Mary, we must have the kind of charity she had. It can serve as a reminder. So with your permission, I'll do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livin_the_MASS Posted April 14, 2004 Author Share Posted April 14, 2004 [quote name='Good Friday' date='Apr 13 2004, 11:55 PM']Jason, once dUSt answers your question, can I have your permission to change the title of this thread to "The Imitation of Mary & Charity," lock it, and pin it? I think it needs to be right at the top of the Debate Table for all to see that, in order to imitate Mary, we must have the kind of charity she had. It can serve as a reminder. So with your permission, I'll do that.[/quote] Yes you may Goodfriday! I'd love stay and talk but back to work I go! I'll be back later! God Bless Pham Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livin_the_MASS Posted April 14, 2004 Author Share Posted April 14, 2004 bump. Dust if you feel you do not want to answer my question will you pm me and tell me there please!? God Bless Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted April 14, 2004 Share Posted April 14, 2004 One moment please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livin_the_MASS Posted April 14, 2004 Author Share Posted April 14, 2004 Sorry I got to go, I'm on lunch, don't want a spanking! I will read later. Thanks Dust! God Bless Pham Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted April 14, 2004 Share Posted April 14, 2004 [quote name='Jason' date='Apr 13 2004, 04:09 PM'] Dust I ask you this question because I want to help, not to be a problem. I know you have said before "debunk the issue" I think? I try to do this but it seems that when someone has an accusion against us and we or I give an answer, it is like it was never given or typed out. How do you adress the issue in a charitable manner when pictures are shown with statements. I ask this for advise because I'm sure it will happen again in the future. [/quote] Well, I think it's important to separate the issue from the rhetoric. Ignore the emotion and approach the argument in an almost mathemetical way. 1. Paraphrase and define the opponent's last point [i](this is where you take out all the fluff, emotion, irrelevant arguments, etc)[/i] 2. Address the point directly or ask questions so that their point can be further clarified 3. End with the reason why the Church's view is correct [i](this can almost always be done without the need to show how wrong the other side is)[/i] As Catholics, we are called to live our faith because we know it to be true. Our [b]example[/b] will have a far greater affect on anyone than our efforts to tell them how they are wrong. A non-attacking approach will insure that the other person will not go into a close-minded defense mode--and that alone, I believe, does more for dialogue than the best theological arguments in the world. Basically, follow the example set forth in the Bible, and encouraged by the saints. God bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livin_the_MASS Posted April 14, 2004 Author Share Posted April 14, 2004 [quote name='dUSt' date='Apr 14 2004, 01:17 PM'] Well, I think it's important to separate the issue from the rhetoric. Ignore the emotion and approach the argument in an almost mathemetical way. 1. Paraphrase and define the opponent's last point [i](this is where you take out all the fluff, emotion, irrelevant arguments, etc)[/i] 2. Address the point directly or ask questions so that their point can be further clarified 3. End with the reason why the Church's view is correct [i](this can almost always be done without the need to show how wrong the other side is)[/i] As Catholics, we are called to live our faith because we know it to be true. Our [b]example[/b] will have a far greater affect on anyone than our efforts to tell them how they are wrong. A non-attacking approach will insure that the other person will not go into a close-minded defense mode--and that alone, I believe, does more for dialogue than the best theological arguments in the world. Basically, follow the example set forth in the Bible, and encouraged by the saints. God bless. [/quote] Advice taken, thanks Dust. Good Friday you can have the thread. God Bless Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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