Future Of The Roman Rite

[aalpha1989]

Sorry for the ensuing vagueness, but...

What is the future of the Roman Rite? Are we going to see the two Missals currently in use influence one another (specifically, the 1962 Missal influencing the 1970)? Are we going to see a return to Gregorian Chant in the OF? Will there be another time when most churches celebrate ad orientem? Will we see a return to Communion rails and decreased use of EMHC's? Increased Latin in the Ordinary of the Mass? What's happening? How far will the Reform of the Reform go?

I don't think the 1970 Missal will influence the 1962 much at all. I'm interested in what y'all think our future is... It is a little painful to see the Rite split into two Forms, but it is also difficult to see that split healed without major changes in the use of the Novus Ordo.

[zunshynn]

Personally, I don't see the 1962 changing much beyond an updating of the calendar and... yeah.

Maybe the use of the vernacular for some parts, but I kind of doubt it.

It's hard to say because it seems like the average Catholic is still basically clueless that there is even a reform of the reform going on. Plus you still have a fair number of bishops that are likely to be uncooperative with any major changes.

[Nihil Obstat]

Personally I'd love to see the Ambrosian Rite become more popular as well, but I know that isn't very realistic.

[zunshynn]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='06 April 2010 - 12:44 AM' timestamp='1270536284' post='2087554']
Personally I'd love to see the Ambrosian Rite become more popular as well, but I know that isn't very realistic.
[/quote]

Indeed.

Actually, that's exactly what I think is going to happen. I mean, not necessarily in regard to the Ambrosian Rite, but with the EF... As it becomes more available, I think it's going to become more and more people's preference, and eventually the Novus Ordo will become more or less obsolete. In the mean time though, and by the mean time I mean pretty slowly, I think there will be changes like going back to the communion rail, communion on the tongue, and a slow return to proper music. I guess I don't expect any major structural changes to either one... but that the NO will slowly start to be celebrated... well, more the way it was just supposed to be celebrated in the first place... and as that happens people will naturally be more inclined to the EF.

I think that the Office will change back as well, but a lot more slowly, precisely because the shift in that regard will mostly rest with religious communities.

I also have a feeling that many people will leave the faith though... not necessarily over the liturgy, though... and that the Church will be much smaller, but also more fervent in the years to come.

[Bennn]

I don't know what is going to happen. The future lies not in our hands. I am convinced, though, that if the Holy Spirit allowed the OF of the Liturgy to come into existance, there is a reason for it. I'd already be happy if Priests and laity would simply follow the rubrics of the Missal instead of 'improvising'. I think it's too bad that the EF is not very widespread, as I am very attracted to it. Here in Belgium, we only have one Bishop who also has a love for the EF, that is Mgr. Léonard, and as an answer to our prayers he has now been chosen by Pope Benedict XVI to be Archbishop. So things might be about to change here. Now, that's Divine Provicence, don't you think?

+Pax
Ben

[zunshynn]

[quote name='Bennn' date='06 April 2010 - 08:05 AM' timestamp='1270562757' post='2087624']
I don't know what is going to happen. The future lies not in our hands. I am convinced, though, that if the Holy Spirit allowed the OF of the Liturgy to come into existance, there is a reason for it. I'd already be happy if Priests and laity would simply follow the rubrics of the Missal instead of 'improvising'. I think it's too bad that the EF is not very widespread, as I am very attracted to it.
[/quote]

I think that the Lord used/is using the Novus Ordo to remind the Church what she had in the Mass as it had been celebrated for centuries, and not to take it for granted.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='zunshynn' date='06 April 2010 - 02:16 AM' timestamp='1270538176' post='2087560']
Indeed.

Actually, that's exactly what I think is going to happen. I mean, not necessarily in regard to the Ambrosian Rite, but with the EF... As it becomes more available, I think it's going to become more and more people's preference, and eventually the Novus Ordo will become more or less obsolete. In the mean time though, and by the mean time I mean pretty slowly, I think there will be changes like going back to the communion rail, communion on the tongue, and a slow return to proper music. I guess I don't expect any major structural changes to either one... but that the NO will slowly start to be celebrated... well, more the way it was just supposed to be celebrated in the first place... and as that happens people will naturally be more inclined to the EF.

I think that the Office will change back as well, but a lot more slowly, precisely because the shift in that regard will mostly rest with religious communities.

I also have a feeling that many people will leave the faith though... not necessarily over the liturgy, though... and that the Church will be much smaller, but also more fervent in the years to come.
[/quote]
I think I'd have to agree with you. Definitely will be extremely slow. Maybe on the scale of a few hundred years.
Still, as long as we're working in the right direction...

[Bennn]

[quote name='zunshynn' date='06 April 2010 - 04:48 PM' timestamp='1270565311' post='2087646']
I think that the Lord used/is using the Novus Ordo to remind the Church what she had in the Mass as it had been celebrated for centuries, and not to take it for granted.
[/quote]


Hey... I like that idea. That might very well be true. That would probably explain the renewed interest in the EF of the Mass that is living within this generation of youth.

Traditio ftw.[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/love.gif[/img] [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/incense.gif[/img]

Edited April 6, 2010 by Bennn

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='06 April 2010 - 01:44 AM' timestamp='1270536284' post='2087554']
Personally I'd love to see the Ambrosian Rite become more popular as well, but I know that isn't very realistic.
[/quote]

I ceratinly wouldn't want the [i]revised[/i] Ambrosian Rite becoming more popular.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Resurrexi' date='06 April 2010 - 03:26 PM' timestamp='1270585596' post='2087844']
I ceratinly wouldn't want the [i]revised[/i] Ambrosian Rite becoming more popular.
[/quote]
So I've heard. Sad story.

Although I didn't understand any of the arguments for or against.

[zunshynn]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='06 April 2010 - 02:40 PM' timestamp='1270586450' post='2087854']
So I've heard. Sad story.

Although I didn't understand any of the arguments for or against.
[/quote]

Not fixing something that isn't broken is the best argument in my not so humble opinion.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='zunshynn' date='06 April 2010 - 03:46 PM' timestamp='1270586765' post='2087860']
Not fixing something that isn't broken is the best argument in my not so humble opinion.
[/quote]
Well yea, that's the obvious part.

I was reading a point/counterpoint, but the arguments were so technical that I couldn't even tell which side was the more orthodox.

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='06 April 2010 - 03:50 PM' timestamp='1270587022' post='2087866']
Well yea, that's the obvious part.

I was reading a point/counterpoint, but the arguments were so technical that I couldn't even tell which side was the more orthodox.
[/quote]

I wasn't talking about the recent revisions to the Ambrosian Rite (which I think are what you are talking about). I am talking about the revisions to the Ambrosian Rite in the 1970s. I was basically saying that I don't want the Ambrosian Novus Ordo becoming more popular.

Edited April 6, 2010 by Resurrexi

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Resurrexi' date='06 April 2010 - 04:09 PM' timestamp='1270588173' post='2087882']
I wasn't talking about the recent revisions to the Ambrosian Rite (which I think are what you are talking about). I am talking about the revisions to the Ambrosian Rite in the 1970s. I was basically saying that I don't want the Ambrosian Novus Ordo becoming more popular.
[/quote]
Ah, ok. See that's like... 110% lost on me. Are the recent revisions good or bad ones?

Ooh, know what's really cool? The old Rite of Lyons, which was Gallican.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='06 April 2010 - 04:42 PM' timestamp='1270590175' post='2087918']
Ah, ok. See that's like... 110% lost on me. Are the recent revisions good or bad ones?

Ooh, know what's really cool? The old Rite of Lyons, which was Gallican.
[/quote]
Hehe, in the procession of a Pontifical Mass in the Rite of Lyons, there are 36 people.
[url="http://www.newliturgicalmovement.org/2008/02/rite-of-lyons.html"]NLM Article[/url]