May A Catholic Vote For A Whig Candidate?

[Vincent Vega]

[quote]Abortion

Our members are split on this subject just like the rest of the country. But the bottom line is that this one particular issue should not be the sole basis for which political party people affiliate with. For example, many "pro-choice" voters find themselves agreeing with many traditionally GOP issues while many of those opposed to abortion rights find themselves agreeing with many Democratic issues. Despite this fact, voters too often are pushed to choose one party or the other due to the abortion issue alone. It is time to end the trend of having this one issue become a deal breaker. Each state can determine its course of action like any other public health issue that revolves around medical procedures. The federal government should not get involved or regulate such items as the less involvement by the government in our private lives the better.

In addition, we encourage states to consider additional funding for greater access to adoption for people wishing not to keep a child and for qualified couples or individuals wishing to become parents of adopted children. Responsible safe-haven laws also give people an additional option beyond abortion. We support all policies giving couples additional options beyond abortion, making this practice even more rare.[/quote]
[i]From: http://www.modernwhig.org/page8/page8.html[/i]

Is this stance compatible with Church teaching?

[zunshynn]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' date='08 March 2010 - 10:49 PM' timestamp='1268113779' post='2069441']
[i]From: http://www.modernwhig.org/page8/page8.html[/i]

Is this stance compatible with Church teaching?
[/quote]

I don't think the stance is ideal, but it could potentially be the best option available. As for voting for a whig, I think it would depend on their individual positions. I mean, you can vote for a pro-life democrat, morally speaking. Why someone would, I don't know... But you could.

[Nihil Obstat]

I don't really understand how the issue functions in the US, so I can't take either side.

[Jesus_lol]

seems about right to me. i personally would like to vote for a prolife democrat, as i could never bring myself to vote for the current republican party(if hypothetically i lived in the states.)

its right about it being a deal breaker, and that it shouldnt have to be.

[KeenanParkerII]

[quote]seems about right to me. i personally would like to vote for a prolife democrat, as i could never bring myself to vote for the current republican party(if hypothetically i lived in the states.)

its right about it being a deal breaker, and that it shouldnt have to be. [/quote]

So who do you vote for in Canada seeing as all parties support abortion, and the conservatives kind of smell of elderberries?

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='KeenanParkerII' date='09 March 2010 - 10:42 AM' timestamp='1268152949' post='2069558']
So who do you vote for in Canada seeing as all parties support abortion, and the conservatives kind of smell of elderberries?
[/quote]
The trouble isn't that they all support abortion. They might, but that's not the problem. The problem is that the abortion debate is considered over. It's really a sad scenario.

In my opinion, voting Conservative is the best option. I support them more than the other parties in terms of economics, etc., but the main reason is that we may very well have a euthanasia debate coming in the next decade or so, and the Conservatives are the only party that will probably be on the right side.

[KeenanParkerII]

Wait, so it's not a problem that they support abortion? =o

(I agree, though I dislike how Stephen Harper sells away our national sovereignty, provides America with radioactive material, destroys BC's lumber industry and gives all of BC's hard earned profit to Quebec.)

[MissyP89]

I didn't know we still had Whigs.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='KeenanParkerII' date='09 March 2010 - 10:49 AM' timestamp='1268153370' post='2069563']
Wait, so it's not a problem that they support abortion? =o

(I agree, though I dislike how Stephen Harper sells away our national sovereignty, provides America with radioactive material, destroys BC's lumber industry and gives all of BC's hard earned profit to Quebec.)
[/quote]
Well they all "support" abortion in that none of them are willing to re-open the debate. There is no pro-life candidate, except for maybe a few scattered independents in individual ridings. Since there's no pro-life candidate, the options are spoiling your ballot or voting for the strongest of what's left, and in my opinion that's the party that will be on our side on euthanasia.
(I'm not a fan of transfer payments either, considering what province I live in, but it's not Harper's fault.)

Edited March 9, 2010 by Nihil Obstat

[Jesus_lol]

[quote name='KeenanParkerII' date='09 March 2010 - 08:42 AM' timestamp='1268152949' post='2069558']
So who do you vote for in Canada seeing as all parties support abortion, and the conservatives kind of smell of elderberries?
[/quote]

wasnt sure. last time the liberals were weak, the conservatives were just dishonest and dissembling. maybe the NDP? i dunno, i was gonna choose by watching the debates, where i thought the Greens actually did fairly well, but they are basically unelectable, so i dont know. talk to me next election

but yeah, i cant stand Harper and what he has done to canada.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[img]http://www.fantasycostumes.com/mm5/costumes-images/colonial-man-wig-economy-5044-pa.jpg[/img]

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='09 March 2010 - 11:55 AM' timestamp='1268153735' post='2069567']
Well they all "support" abortion in that none of them are willing to re-open the debate. There is no pro-life candidate, except for maybe a few scattered independents in individual ridings. Since there's no pro-life candidate, the options are spoiling your ballot or voting for the strongest of what's left, and in my opinion that's the party that will be on our side on euthanasia.
(I'm not a fan of transfer payments either, considering what province I live in, but it's not Harper's fault.)
[/quote]


Voting for a third party or independent candidate is not a wasted vote. To continue voting for the parties in power is to give up on more important issues and to effectively dismiss the abortion debate as "over" yourself. The only way abortion will stay legal forever is if you accept the political status quo.

I was addressing Canadian voting, not US voting. We still have a major party that is mostly pro-life.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='aalpha1989' date='09 March 2010 - 12:03 PM' timestamp='1268157812' post='2069612']
Voting for a third party or independent candidate is not a wasted vote. To continue voting for the parties in power is to give up on more important issues and to effectively dismiss the abortion debate as "over" yourself. The only way abortion will stay legal forever is if you accept the political status quo.

I was addressing Canadian voting, not US voting. We still have a major party that is mostly pro-life.
[/quote]
The problem with "independents" in the Canadian system is
a) there aren't very many. Maybe one or two in every major city
b) out of these "independents", many of them still aren't pro-life in any discernible way
c) they're poor candidates to begin with (because the vast, vast majority of candidates with any sense get into one of the major parties).

The Canadian system is rather different from the American one.
Personally, I believe that most Conservatives would want to at least address abortion in some way. The problem, obviously, is that they're politicians, and addressing abortion in Canada in any way is political suicide at the moment. Obviously we who are pro life (who I think are in the minority now in Canada) will still make the issue known to all of our politicians, but to be realistic, at the moment they won't do a thing about it. For the time being, the pro life movement in Canada has to act from a more grassroots level. It has to be bottom up. Hopefully in time we can change the political climate to a great enough extent that it will be debated again, but for now it's just not a realistic goal.
There are plenty of pro-life organizations though. They're not political, so they work on the personal level. They do a lot of good.

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='09 March 2010 - 01:19 PM' timestamp='1268158744' post='2069617']
The problem with "independents" in the Canadian system is
a) there aren't very many. Maybe one or two in every major city
b) out of these "independents", many of them still aren't pro-life in any discernible way
c) they're poor candidates to begin with (because the vast, vast majority of candidates with any sense get into one of the major parties).
[/quote]

"A" only applies if there aren't any available.
"B" is a good thing to think about, but irrelevent to my post because I was advocating voting for pro-life candidates.
"C" is only worthy of consideration if there are multiple candidates who are pro-life. However poor the candidates may be, I think sacrificing good foreign policy is worth saving the lives of literally millions of people. Weigh your priorities and decide whether these lives are worth discarding in favor of good economic policy (or whatever other policies you had in mind). If you refrain from voting for the only available pro-life candidate solely because his temporal policies are bad (as opposed to his spiritual and moral policies), then ask yourself what is more important.

[quote]
The Canadian system is rather different from the American one.
Personally, I believe that most Conservatives would want to at least address abortion in some way. The problem, obviously, is that they're politicians, and addressing abortion in Canada in any way is political suicide at the moment. Obviously we who are pro life (who I think are in the minority now in Canada) will still make the issue known to all of our politicians, but to be realistic, at the moment they won't do a thing about it. For the time being, the pro life movement in Canada has to act from a more grassroots level. It has to be bottom up. Hopefully in time we can change the political climate to a great enough extent that it will be debated again, but for now it's just not a realistic goal.
There are plenty of pro-life organizations though. They're not political, so they work on the personal level. They do a lot of good.
[/quote]

I agree with you that most of the work must be grassroots. You are right that that is the primary objective, to convert the hearts and minds of the people, but it must be apparent in your voting that this is your goal. If you advocate conversion but your voting record is indiscernable from your neighbors', then you are doing nothing but continuing the status quo.


Nihil, I don't mean to be demeaning or to attack you personally. I am merely pointing out moral objections I have to voting for any pro-death candidate(whether it be euthenasia or abortion). If no pro-life candidate is available, I know that it is viewed as morally permissible to vote for the pro-death one who most conforms himself to Catholic values. I personally would refrain from voting, though, because I cannot bring myself to support any pro-death policies. It is difficult for me to see a Catholic choosing the lesser of two evils when the two evils are basically equal.

Edited March 9, 2010 by aalpha1989

[Socrates]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' date='09 March 2010 - 12:49 AM' timestamp='1268113779' post='2069441']
[i]From: http://www.modernwhig.org/page8/page8.html[/i]

Is this stance compatible with Church teaching?
[/quote]
It's weaker than the stance of the GOP Platform, but a bit preferable to that of the Dems.
Browsing their site, I really don't see much reason to vote Whig. They've got a few good ideas, but not a lot to strongly distinguish them from other political parties. A lot of their stances look a bit vague or compromised.
For a third-party alternative, I'd prefer the Constitution Party, or perhaps the Libertarians.