Are You Scared Of Religious Life?

[TIWW]

[font="Arial Narrow"] Lillabett, thank you for such an honest and heartfelt response . You have obviously grown and healed in so many ways, since what had to have been some very difficult physical and emotional challenges. Not that what you had to offer when you came to Religious life was not valuable, but the gift of your growth and healing has put you in a place where, if you do choose to try Religious Life again, you will bring to Christ and a new community the gift of a much more “ whole” person. Naturally, if we Love Christ, this relationship grows and deepens, and we adapt physically, spiritually and emotionally along the way. And the way we interact with others changes too.
Much of what you have said, caused me to reflect about the idea of ” fear.” And more specifically the experience and maturity to even be afraid.
I entered an active community, when I was very young and then a cloistered contemplative one when I was in my 30’s. Both were very unique, wonderful, positive and rewarding experiences, but I was a very different person with each experience. In the first, I was just so excited and elated to do what I’d wanted to do since I was about 10 years old. And join the Sisters whom I’d grown up across the street from. I was too young, inexperienced and naïve to be afraid. I loved God and the community, with a fervor I can recall to this day, I loved putting on my Postulant’s habit, praying with, working with and playing with my class every single day. But I was not in any way mature enough to deal with the realities at the time.I knew I was not ready and it nearly killed me, because I knew God had called me. Ileft on my own and it was the most difficult thing I’ve ever done. The other young women all came to the table with individual gifts and failings. Only a few of a Postulant class of 46 had the mental, emotional and spiritual where with all to deal with the challenges. Today, nearly 40 years later, I am still friends with many of these women, including my Postulant Mistress.

Entering Religious Life, not only brings us face to face with God, in a way unknown to us before entering, but it also brings us face to face with who we really are. It demands that we confront what makes us tick, outside of our comfort zone in the real world, whether that be family, friends or work. Any wounds, fears, imperfections, needs come to the fore, and we must deal with them with any tools we have in our tool box.
(If we are young, unless we are exceptional, that tool box can be fairly empty)

I so believe in Transformation by Grace and that “Daily we are renewed in Christ” That is part of my morning prayer. So that each day we greet the world with the vision that Christ makes us whole in Him[/font]

[DiscerningSoul]

[quote name='Saint Therese' date='05 March 2010 - 12:46 PM' timestamp='1267807608' post='2067058']
For me its scarier to think of NOT becoming a religious, NOT doing God's will for me.
[/quote]
That is so true to me too.

[cmaD2006]

[quote name='Saint Therese' date='05 March 2010 - 12:46 PM' timestamp='1267807608' post='2067058']
For me its scarier to think of NOT becoming a religious, NOT doing God's will for me.
[/quote]

I'm not sure if I will say this correctly, since in my own mind I don't have it 100% straight.

God's will is that we are saved through Jesus, that we Love Him and seek to be holy. Whether that is in religious life or not ... that is secondary.

He gives us the option ... free will ... to choose. We can choose to marry, we can choose to stay single, we can choose religious life, (for those who are men ... you can choose Holy Orders), we can choose to consecrate ourselves via a secular institute ... etc. As long as it is a choice between two (or more) "good" then it is a true choice in freedom and Love of God (ex: a choice to sin is a choice of death, a choice to go against God).

The key is placing God first and foremost in our lives, and out of Love to keep His commandments. Anything else is secondary.

I point this out because for the longest time I had the same fear, and now that I live the reality that I may never become a religious I honestly think that striving for holiness is key, wherever that may lead.

[AccountDeleted]

[quote name='cmariadiaz' date='06 March 2010 - 02:32 PM' timestamp='1267846360' post='2067339']
I'm not sure if I will say this correctly, since in my own mind I don't have it 100% straight.

God's will is that we are saved through Jesus, that we Love Him and seek to be holy. Whether that is in religious life or not ... that is secondary.

He gives us the option ... free will ... to choose. We can choose to marry, we can choose to stay single, we can choose religious life, (for those who are men ... you can choose Holy Orders), we can choose to consecrate ourselves via a secular institute ... etc. As long as it is a choice between two (or more) "good" then it is a true choice in freedom and Love of God (ex: a choice to sin is a choice of death, a choice to go against God).

The key is placing God first and foremost in our lives, and out of Love to keep His commandments. Anything else is secondary.

I point this out because for the longest time I had the same fear, and now that I live the reality that I may never become a religious I honestly think that striving for holiness is key, wherever that may lead.
[/quote]

I think you've said it pretty well here. Thank you. We all have the fear of not doing God's will I think, if we love Him, because who doesn't want to please the one they love? But doing God's will is different than "knowing" God's will. I was in Carmel, doing God' will, in my opinion, to the best of my ability. Then the situation changed and I was given no choice about whether or not to leave, I had to leave. I did God's will by obeying the Mother Prioress. Now I want to do God's will again, but I don't know what that is, so I see a spiritual director, attend daily Mass, pray the Office and the Rosary, contemplation, etc etc, while trying to earn enough to feed and house myself. God's will is about sanctifying our soul. Father Nelson of the IRL even told me that personally when I met with him. First and foremost is the sanctification of our soul, then comes how we do that.

I still want to do God's will, but I can't know any more than I know. If He leads me into religious life again, then I will welcome that (fears or not), but if He doesn't, then I have to trust that He still loves me and wants me anyway. The feeling of not being wanted is a very heavy Cross to carry, but so are lots of other Crosses that people have. So as long as we keep walking towards him with love, then He will see that we get where He wants us to be. I am just grateful that I can still love Him. There are a lot of people who don't. The gift of faith, of loving Jesus, of striving to keep my soul pure for Him, these things are my vocation. If He wants more or even the same in a different way, then He will have to lead me there.

Thank you cmariadiaz for a lovely post.

Edited March 6, 2010 by nunsense

[TeresaBenedicta]

I think that every vocation is feared in some way or another. For many people, especially my generation, [i]commitment[/i] is one of the scariest things. To commit to something means making a decision that rules out other possibilities by its own very nature. Our culture is brought up thinking that we need to try everything under the sun before being able to make a long-term commitment, and even then that must be done with caution... So in that sense, I think there's a bit of fear whenever anyone is making a significant choice in terms of vocation.

For myself... there's definitely the "commitment" fear, which has been ingrained into me since I was a child. In fact, I was just talking to my brother about my vocation for the first time the other night and he responded exactly with the same sort of mindset. He thought it was great that I should follow my dreams and do what I thought would be most fulfilling... but that I ought to explore, live life, try other things, so that I could [i]really[/i] know what it was I am choosing.

This sort of fear can be really debilitating in the beginnings of discernment, I think. But, "perfect love casts out all fear" and I think that's true for this. Love will give one the courage to make the commitment, the desire to make the commitment. And sometimes this all within God's timing. I definitely fell into the camp of "fear of commitment" and I was scared I'd never actually be able to make the "jump" and go for it... [i]until[/i] I found the Order I believe God wants for me and discovered His timing. Once He put things into motion, I was given the grace to overcome this particular fear.

There are other fears as well, ones that may or may not be unique to the religious vocation. For me personally, I have a fear of the difficulty of the vow of obedience. In some things I think it will come very easy for me. In others, I know it will be very very difficult.

I fear how my relationship with my parents is going to progress. Right now they don't understand my vocation at all, although they are as supportive as they can be. That's difficult and I'm afraid of hurting them, which I know I must to do by pursuing my vocation.

I fear failing... whatever that might mean...

As a melancholic-choleric, I tend towards worrying too much about these sorts of things and can fall prey to perfectionism. But, one thing God has been teaching me in these past few months where the discernment-action has heated up quite a bit... is trust and abandonment. It's all about acting, to the best of our abilities, in accordance with His will. It's about acting in a way that seeks His joy, which in turn will give us the fullness of joy. It's about abandoning all things into His hands and letting Him decide what fruit He wishes to produce from our actions.

[LightofMary]

[quote name='cmariadiaz' date='05 March 2010 - 10:32 PM' timestamp='1267846360' post='2067339']
I'm not sure if I will say this correctly, since in my own mind I don't have it 100% straight.

God's will is that we are saved through Jesus, that we Love Him and seek to be holy. Whether that is in religious life or not ... that is secondary.

He gives us the option ... free will ... to choose. We can choose to marry, we can choose to stay single, we can choose religious life, (for those who are men ... you can choose Holy Orders), we can choose to consecrate ourselves via a secular institute ... etc. As long as it is a choice between two (or more) "good" then it is a true choice in freedom and Love of God (ex: a choice to sin is a choice of death, a choice to go against God).

The key is placing God first and foremost in our lives, and out of Love to keep His commandments. Anything else is secondary.

I point this out because for the longest time I had the same fear, and now that I live the reality that I may never become a religious I honestly think that striving for holiness is key, wherever that may lead.
[/quote]

Jesus said "You did not CHOOSE me, I CHOSE you." Religious life is an invitation to a life of living out the full commitment we embraced during our baptism. We are free to accept or reject, it is true, just like we are free to accept Jesus or reject Him. Every vocation is not for us to choose. It is already determined by God. Our role is to DISCOVER it. That is the grand adventure of a lifetime. God calls us to a place where we can be fully happy with Him, whether married or consecrated man and woman. If one is not happy in religious life, it is because one is probably not called there. If we place God first and foremost in our lives, and ourselves secondary, we will be open to wherever His Will leads us. That could mean religious life for some. The bottom line is - OPENNESS and HUMILITY to accept God's will and the willingness to DISCERN where one's place is in life.

[Cherie]

[quote name='Lilllabettt' date='04 March 2010 - 03:19 PM' timestamp='1267730383' post='2066564']
I have been thinking about this thread for a little while.

I cannot say that there was any injustice done to me when I left religious life. I cannot even say "it wasn't my fault," because it was. Of course, I was physically sick; that was not my fault. But I was emotionally sick too, and I think that played a role in my leaving. No one said that to me, of course. But I think so. There appeared in me this emotional woundedness that I had never noticed before; from past hurts, abuse, etc. I was needy in religious life. I really was. I loved attention. Just self-absorbed, needy.

It has been a couple years now. I like to think that I have grown. I'm not shy anymore, for example. I don't "catastrophize" everything. I'm not so afraid ... I mean I feel confident about life, that I am just as good, just as worthy, just as capable as anybody. Which is a lot different than before ... and I feel strong. Physically, I am healed. Sometimes I think the physical catastrophe was sent to help me heal from the emotional wounds; I had to take care of myself and that proved to me that I could do it.

I've had informal visits, with two local communities ... you know, just spend the afternoon. Do these experiences fill my heart with joy, yes. But I know this is no true guide; I was overflowing with joy "the last time." Night after night I went to bed in my cell crying for joy. So this is no true guide for me.

Now, I do not know if I can try again. I read somewhere that in religious life there were two types of people: givers and receivers. Before, I was a receiver. The life was such a happy thing to me, I didn't consider it a real sacrifice. This time, I know it would be a real sacrifice, and I would have to be a giver. Do I have the wear-with-all to be a giver?

I know, looking back, that I did not see the severity of my weakness before. And so perhaps it is the same now. Religious life will dredge up whatever is still there. Am I sufficiently healed? Someone I was with in the convent left sometime after me. I tried to get in touch with her, and she wrote back saying she had no desire to be in touch, and that as far she was concerned, I did not have a vocation, since people like me ("manipulative" and "deceitful" were her words) don't belong in religious life, period. We were never friends, and she has troubles of her own that make her do/say inappropriate things sometimes. But her description of me is not entirely unjustified.

I am graduating from school next Fall, and so there is the question of what the next step in life is going to be. A job? Graduate school? I'm not ready to enter religious life. Maybe in a year? Or two? Three? Or maybe never, because I am too afraid. Or never, because I'm irreparably broken, just not brave enough to face the fact.

Even if that's true, I'm at peace with it. Because God loves misery in a person, you know? He loves to save the miserable. It's just another reason only God can save me
[/quote]

Elizabeth I was very touched by your response here. You are a beautiful soul and I am grateful to God that He brought us together, for the time that we were in the convent, so that I could know you. I want you to know that I have kept you in my prayers ever since, and will continue to do so.

When I read the response you received from someone (I'm quite sure I know who) it made me very angry that someone would say something like that to you. I'm very impressed with the response you gave to that, because it showed you know that someone who would say something like that has issues of her own to deal with -- but please know that you are treasured and loved by God, and that the Sisters you knew in the convent loved you, also.

[cmaD2006]

[quote name='LightofMary' date='07 March 2010 - 11:09 AM' timestamp='1267974551' post='2068011']
Jesus said "You did not CHOOSE me, I CHOSE you." Religious life is an invitation to a life of living out the full commitment we embraced during our baptism. We are free to accept or reject, it is true, just like we are free to accept Jesus or reject Him. Every vocation is not for us to choose. It is already determined by God. Our role is to DISCOVER it. That is the grand adventure of a lifetime. God calls us to a place where we can be fully happy with Him, whether married or consecrated man and woman. If one is not happy in religious life, it is because one is probably not called there. If we place God first and foremost in our lives, and ourselves secondary, we will be open to wherever His Will leads us. That could mean religious life for some. The bottom line is - OPENNESS and HUMILITY to accept God's will and the willingness to DISCERN where one's place is in life.
[/quote]

I disagree with the statement "We are free to accept or reject, it is true, just like we are free to accept Jesus or reject Him."

That is an incorrect statement with regards to vocation ... because it is a discernment of two (or more) "good"s. That is not the same as saying that a person accepts or rejects Jesus. It is not a valid comparison. Now, if you had said "We are free to marry or to live with my boyfriend/girlfriend outside of marriage, it is true, just like we are free to accept Jesus or reject Him" then you would have had a correct analogy.

You are correct in saying that discernment is required, really for every major decision we make. I also agree with "if you're not happy in religious life then you are not called to it"; except I would clarify it and say "if you are not happy within a religious community then you are not called to that community". Not being called to a community doesn't necessarily mean you are not called to religious life. And I would caution about making a judgement about someone's happiness in religious life (or even in a particular community) ... for really the only one who truly knows the state of the heart is God.

So many things happen in community as well ... it is hard to judge without knowing the circumstances, and sometimes all of us are quick at making those judgements without having the full facts.

Finally, I'm not 100% sure if I agree with God predetermining each person's vocation. Again ... God helps us discern between two "good"s, and I can't believe that He would not bless us in the decision that we make if we kept Him in mind. I guess only when we are in His presence will we know for sure if He did "predetermine" and if we completely missed it.

Blessings to all during this Lenten season, and may God through the gentle guidance of the Holy Spirit prepare (and purify) our hearts for the joy of Easter.

Edited March 7, 2010 by cmariadiaz

[brightsadness]

I have just started to understand that I am afraid of obedience. It requires the kind of trust that I don't have and will have to learn. And many of your posts have taught me that learning is not without cost. But like St. Therese (my prayerpal)I'm more afraid of not entering. Niether my love nor my trust is perfect, but His is. And I will try to be faithful to that..

[LightofMary]

[quote name='cmariadiaz' date='07 March 2010 - 02:04 PM' timestamp='1267988650' post='2068108']
I disagree with the statement "We are free to accept or reject, it is true, just like we are free to accept Jesus or reject Him."

That is an incorrect statement with regards to vocation ... because it is a discernment of two (or more) "good"s. That is not the same as saying that a person accepts or rejects Jesus. It is not a valid comparison. Now, if you had said "We are free to marry or to live with my boyfriend/girlfriend outside of marriage, it is true, just like we are free to accept Jesus or reject Him" then you would have had a correct analogy.

You are correct in saying that discernment is required, really for every major decision we make. I also agree with "if you're not happy in religious life then you are not called to it"; except I would clarify it and say "if you are not happy within a religious community then you are not called to that community". Not being called to a community doesn't necessarily mean you are not called to religious life. And I would caution about making a judgement about someone's happiness in religious life (or even in a particular community) ... for really the only one who truly knows the state of the heart is God.

So many things happen in community as well ... it is hard to judge without knowing the circumstances, and sometimes all of us are quick at making those judgements without having the full facts.

Finally, I'm not 100% sure if I agree with God predetermining each person's vocation. Again ... God helps us discern between two "good"s, and I can't believe that He would not bless us in the decision that we make if we kept Him in mind. I guess only when we are in His presence will we know for sure if He did "predetermine" and if we completely missed it.

Blessings to all during this Lenten season, and may God through the gentle guidance of the Holy Spirit prepare (and purify) our hearts for the joy of Easter.
[/quote]

The context of [i]"We are free to accept or reject, it is true, just like we are free to accept Jesus or reject Him."[/i] is based on the theology of freedom. It is in the context of "free will" whether you mean vocation or personal salvation. It is not meant as a comparison with the object of this rejection but the act of rejection. Just as we are given that choice to accept or reject one's calling, we are also given that choice to accept Jesus as Savior. It does not mean that if one rejects a calling to religious life, one rejects Jesus. I am only referring to our [b]ability to choose.

[/b]When one is involved in vocation work, one is obliged to make an OBJECTIVE judgment whether one is happy or not in religious life. Formation work is about testing one's adaptability with regards community life, prayer life and ministry. If one objectively sees that one is crying all the time, finds community acts burdensome and community living oppressive, then one can deduce that that person is not happy in that particular setting/community. Ultimate judgment belongs to God, I agree. But realistically, we make judgments of just about everything in life. There are obvious signs of a true religious calling. Religious life is a life lived with others. It is a call to communion with others. If one cannot live with others, it is a judgment on one's suitability to a life of community. One can still be a religious living a life of solitude and separation from the world such as hermits. But the cenobitic lifestyle or life with others in religious community may not be for everyone. But to be able to discern all these, making judgments is necessary to sift the chaff from the wheat. Judgments about matters of conscience is , needless to say, God's domain.

I think you are misreading the truth about vocations. Vocation is a gift. It is not imposed and surely I agree with you that if one turns it down, one is not "punished" for it. One need not feel guilty if he or she chooses not to accept the gift for whatever reason. Another thing I want to point out here too. Just because one has an attraction to religious life, it does not follow that one has a vocation to it. I want to point that out because some torture themselves with guilt because they find that years later they "lost their vocation." Maybe ,they never had it to begin with.
It is not a popular notion but I will risk it anyway. Religious life is a perfect STATE. It doesn't mean Religious men and women are perfect. Far from it!!! But the state of the evangelical counsels of poverty, obedience and chastity (which is religious life) is a state of perfection. I will use Jesus words to the rich young man who asked him, "what will I do to gain eternal life?" Jesus told him to follow the ten Commandments. The rich young man said, "I have followed all these since my youth." then Jesus said, "If you want to be perfect, sell all you have, give them to the poor, then come and follow Me." (Matthew 19:16-26). Church documents use this story as a prelude to discussions on religious life.

I appreciate your comments.

Edited March 7, 2010 by LightofMary

[cmaD2006]

[quote name='LightofMary' date='07 March 2010 - 05:24 PM' timestamp='1267997082' post='2068243']
The context of [i]"We are free to accept or reject, it is true, just like we are free to accept Jesus or reject Him."[/i] is based on the theology of freedom. It is in the context of "free will" whether you mean vocation or personal salvation. It is not meant as a comparison with the object of this rejection but the act of rejection. Just as we are given that choice to accept or reject one's calling, we are also given that choice to accept Jesus as Savior. It does not mean that if one rejects a calling to religious life, one rejects Jesus. I am only referring to our [b]ability to choose.[/b]
[/quote]

Correct ... but in the original context you said this right after talking about Religous life being an invitation (etc.). It can be misread.

[quote name='LightofMary' date='07 March 2010 - 05:24 PM' timestamp='1267997082' post='2068243']
When one is involved in vocation work, one is obliged to make an OBJECTIVE judgment whether one is happy or not in religious life. Formation work is about testing one's adaptability with regards community life, prayer life and ministry. If one objectively sees that one is crying all the time, finds community acts burdensome and community living oppressive, then one can deduce that that person is not happy in that particular setting/community. Ultimate judgment belongs to God, I agree. But realistically, we make judgments of just about everything in life. There are obvious signs of a true religious calling. Religious life is a life lived with others. It is a call to communion with others. If one cannot live with others, it is a judgment on one's suitability to a life of community. One can still be a religious living a life of solitude and separation from the world such as hermits. But the cenobitic lifestyle or life with others in religious community may not be for everyone. But to be able to discern all these, making judgments is necessary to sift the chaff from the wheat. Judgments about matters of conscience is , needless to say, God's domain.
[/quote]

Yes in the way you state it, those in position of formation would need to make a judgement. I will say though ... there are times that we jump to conclusions without all of the facts.

[quote name='LightofMary' date='07 March 2010 - 05:24 PM' timestamp='1267997082' post='2068243']
I think you are misreading the truth about vocations. Vocation is a gift. It is not imposed and surely I agree with you that if one turns it down, one is not "punished" for it. One need not feel guilty if he or she chooses not to accept the gift for whatever reason. Another thing I want to point out here too. Just because one has an attraction to religious life, it does not follow that one has a vocation to it. I want to point that out because some torture themselves with guilt because they find that years later they "lost their vocation." Maybe ,they never had it to begin with.
It is not a popular notion but I will risk it anyway. Religious life is a perfect STATE. It doesn't mean Religious men and women are perfect. Far from it!!! But the state of the evangelical counsels of poverty, obedience and chastity (which is religious life) is a state of perfection. I will use Jesus words to the rich young man who asked him, "what will I do to gain eternal life?" Jesus told him to follow the ten Commandments. The rich young man said, "I have followed all these since my youth." then Jesus said, "If you want to be perfect, sell all you have, give them to the poor, then come and follow Me." (Matthew 19:16-26). Church documents use this story as a prelude to discussions on religious life.

I appreciate your comments.
[/quote]

I do not think I am misreading the truth about vocations ... and in a way am offended by this statement. God bless you Sister as you continue to walk with the Lord in the path that you have chosen.

Edited March 7, 2010 by cmariadiaz

[LightofMary]

[quote name='cmariadiaz' date='07 March 2010 - 06:57 PM' timestamp='1268006228' post='2068368']

I do not think I am misreading the truth about vocations ... and in a way am offended by this statement. God bless you Sister as you continue to walk with the Lord in the path that you have chosen.
[/quote]

Thank you. No offense intended!