Interpretation

[mulls]

The Bible....


what about it needs to be interpreted?






please don't answer my questions with questions. hopefully, i will refrain from responding to this thread. i want to know what you think about this. i already know what i think, so i'm gonna (try to) not argue about this.

[Livin_the_MASS]

Acts CH 8:26-38



"But an angel of the Lord said to Philip, "Rise and go toward the south to the road that goes down from Jerusalem to Gaza." This is a desert road. And he rose and went. And behold, an Ethiopian, a eunuch, a minister of Candace the queen of the Ethiopians, in charge of all her treasure, had to come to Jerusalem to worship and was returning; seated in his chariot, he was reading the prophet Isaiah. And the Spirit said to Philip, "Go up and join this chariot." So Philip ran to him, and herd him reading Isaiah the prophet, and asked, "Do you understand what you are reading?" And he said, "How can I, unless some one guides me?" And he invited Philip to come up and sit with him. Now the passage of the scripture which he was reading was this: "As a sheep led to the slaughter or a lamb before its shearer is dumb, so he opens not his mouth. In his humiliation justice was denied him. Who can describe his generation? For his life is taken up from the earth." And the eunch said to Philip, "About whom, pray, does the prophet say this, about himself or about some one else?" Then Philip opened his mouth, and bginning with this scripture he told him the good news of Jesus. And as they went along the road they came to some water, and the eunuch said, "See, here is some water! What is to prevent my being baptized?" And he commanded the chariot to stop, and they down into the water, Philip and the eunuch, and he baptized him. "



Now listen to the commentary!



"How can I understand it, unless some one guides me?": to a Jew of this period the very idea of a Messiah who suffers and dies at the hands of his enemies was quite repugnant. This explains why the Ethiopian has difficulty in understanding this passage---and , indeed, the entire song of the Servant of Yahweh, from which it comes (cf. Is 53)
Sometimes it is difficult to understand a passage of Scripture; as St. Jerome comments: "I am not," to speak in passing of himself, " more learned or more holy than that eunuch who travelled to the temple from Ethiopia, that is from the end of the earth: he left the royal palace and such was his desire for divine knowledge that he was even reading the sacred word in his chariot. And yet he did not realize whom he was venerating in that book. Philip comes along, he reveals to him Jesus hidden and as it were imprisoned in the text [...], and in that very moment he believes, is baptized, is faithful and holy. [...] I tell you this to show you that, unless you have a guide who goes ahead of you to show you the way, you cannot enter the holy Scriptures" (Letters, 53, 5-6)
The guide is the church; God, who inspired the sacred books, has entrusted their interpretation to the Church. Therefore the Second Vatican Council teachs that "If we are to derive their true meaning from the sacred texts," attention must be devoted "not only to their content but to the unity of the whole of Scripture, the living tradition of the entire Church, and the analogy of faith [...]
Everything to do with the interpretation of Scripture is ULTIMATELY subject to the judgement of the Church, which exercises the divinely conferred communion and ministry of watching over and interpreting the Word Of God"(Vatican II, Dei Verbum, 12)."

[b] The Navarre Bible[/b]

[Bruce S]

Jason, since you apparently don't understand the WAY a trained Protestant layperson is to INDUCTIVELY, and independly study the Bible, I found this online that might give you some insight. Take a moment, print this out and read it.

Sorry for a doc dump, but this one is a source of confusion and much misunderstanding...

[quote]The Cheat Sheet - Inductive Bible Study


By Richard Krejcir
The Into Thy Word Bible Study Method


¨      THE MAIN GOAL OF BIBLE STUDY: DON’T JUST INTERPRET IT, BUT APPLY IT TO YOUR LIFE!!!

STEP I:  “KNOWING THE KNOWABLE:” BRINGING OUR MIND TO BE RIGHT WITH GOD!



ATTITUDE is crucial!!! (Gal. 2:20)

¨      REMEMBER TO ALWAYS: BEGIN and END YOUR STUDY IN PRAYER and in the meantime be in prayer.

¨      DIRECT YOUR WILL AND SEIZE THE OPPORTUNITY!!! BE CONSISTENT!!!.

¨      BE OPEN TO THE HOLY SPIRIT


STEP II:  “HOW:” THE METHOD OF GETTING INTO GOD’S WORD

LOOK AT THE WHOLE BOOK at least three times in an easy to read translation. Then read each chapter you are studying in a good translation at least three times. Then read the verses, verse by verse in order.




STEP III:  “OBSERVE IT:” ASK WHAT DOES IT SAY?! Before you ask what does it mean and how to apply it to your life!

¨      Give the Book the “Looks:” Purpose; Repeated Phrases; The Point; Who is involved; The time  & sequence of events, “once, then, now, will be, etc.” Look for persons, places, ideas; Logical Connectives, i.e. Therefore, But, Since, So, Thus, Because, For, That, etc.  What is actually being said?

¨      Verbs are crucial! Check out NOUNS in “Bible Dictionaries.”

¨      Consider repeated words & phrases.

¨      Compare passage/verse to similar verses i.e. “Scripture interprets scripture.”  Use a “Concordance.”

¨      Notice what is being taught

¨      Notice the promises

¨      Notice carefully the underlining principle(s) & implications

¨      What about the life, work, teaching, presence of Jesus Christ?

¨      Look out for types of “literary style;” history, philosophy, drama, poetry, wisdom and law.

¨      Look at different translations




STEP III (B):  “OBSERVE IT:”  ASK WHAT DOES IT MEAN?

Let God have His way with you! Ask our Lord to open you before Him, to allow yourself to go beyond your culture, education and experience! Then the meaning will come alive!

¨      We must know our weaknesses and limitations because of sin!

¨      We must be aware of our nature and the nature of Scripture and the Divine Authors intent.

¨      Be focused on Christ not ourselves.

¨      Be aware of the CONTEXT!!!!! The “historical” and “literary” settings?” What is going on?

¨      What is the point and train of thought?

¨      ANALYZE by gathering facts and all the information available to you.

¨      Paraphrase the passage yourself.

¨      What is supported? 

¨      What are the conclusions?

Make an emotional identification into the text.



THINGS TO ASK AND TO APPLY:

¨      Ask what is actually being said?

¨      Try reading aloud!

¨      Consider nothing insignificant!

¨      Have a mentor to ask questions.

¨      Look for stuff to carry out in your life.

¨      Write down your questions

¨      What are the implications & promises to be applied to transformed us?

¨      What about the life, work, teaching, and presence of Jesus Christ? 

¨      How can I model His Character?

¨      What is our duty?

¨      What is God’s character?

¨      Make a commitment to the meaning.

¨      Try to write the verse or entire passage in your own words!

¨      Accept what It says: This is God’s Word!




STEP IV:  “QUESTIONS:” ASK AND LEARN!!!

THE SIX BIG Q’S WE MUST ALWAYS ASK! 

¨      WHO: are the people? Who did it? Who can do it? Who is it talking about?

¨      WHAT: is it saying? What is happening? What is it talking about? What did they do?

¨      WHERE: are they going? Where did it happen? Where will it take place?

¨      WHEN: did it happen? When will it happen? When can it happen?

¨      HOW: did it happen? How can it happen?  How was something done?

¨      WHY: did he say that? Why did he do that? Why did they go there?



ASK THESE ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS:

¨      Are there any commands?

¨      Are there any contrasts?

¨      Are there things repeated?

¨      Is there cause and effect?

¨      Is there a problem and solution?

¨      Are there any promises?

¨      Are there any connections to other parts of the Bible?

¨      Notice the setting!



STEP V:  “KNOW IT”!!!
START LOOKING FOR THE ANSWERS

¨      WHAT DOES SOMETHING MEAN AND WHY IS IT THERE?

¨      Be sure your information is correct!!!

¨      Use good commentaries, Study Bibles, and Bible dictionaries.

Digging Personally:

¨      How are you encouraged & strengthened?

¨      Where have you fallen short, and how can you improve?

¨      What do you now intend to do with the information given to you?

¨      We must have the confidence that the Bible is truth! This is knowing It!

¨      We must allow God’s Word to break our will and desires over to His!

¨      What did God say to you today?

¨      Is there a sin in your life that needs to be confessed and repented?

¨      Are you appreciating it?

¨      Are you receiving and practicing the great benefits to others around you?

¨      Are you a changed person as a result of receiving the Word?



STEP VI:  “APPLICATION!!!” (Gal 5:21-26)

¨      Application comes out of a Changed life.  And leads to a life transformed!

¨      What must I do to make God’s Word real in me? What is my response?

¨      When will it end up in my day planner?

¨      Mediate over the passage



ASK YOURSELF THESE FIVE QUESTIONS:

¨      What illustration can I use to remember?

¨      How does the truth apply to my life?

¨      What is my personal prayer regarding these truths?

¨      What changes/improvements could I make in light of the truth?

¨      How should I carry out these changes?

¨      Pray to ask God how to implement His truth to you. Tell Others. Accountability.



STEP VII: MAKE USE OF THE BOOK CHART 

¨      Write down what God is saying to you and what you have discovered and learned.  By doing this, it will allow you to apply it to your life better!

“You can do it!”



Keep this guide “tucked” in your Bible for reference and guidance.

From: “Into Thy Word” C 2000  R.J. Krejcir [/quote]

This requires a lot of work, but after getting used to this, you only AFTER working this through use the commentaries and any denominational teachings. Contrast them to what YOU learned, and grow.

[Brother Adam]

Aha! but confusious says: But if what you learn is wrong, have you truly learned?

There is nothing wrong with intense Bible study, but you can lead yourself way off base.

Edited April 9, 2004 by Brother Adam

[Bruce S]

[quote]There is nothing wrong with intense Bible study, but you can lead yourself way off base.[/quote]

Absolutely. Agreed.

So can formal groups too, and have, some have been whoppers.

Now, if you can just DEFINE the current commentary [or CCC] and say it is RIGHT, it solves that for the unthinking...

That is why the everyone needs a "Home Plate" that isn't constantly being rewritten by councils and encyclicals.

[Livin_the_MASS]

[quote name='Bruce S' date='Apr 9 2004, 03:55 PM']
Absolutely. Agreed.

So can formal groups too, and have, some have been whoppers.

Now, if you can just DEFINE the current commentary [or CCC] and say it is RIGHT, it solves that for the unthinking...

That is why the everyone needs a "Home Plate" that isn't constantly being rewritten by councils and encyclicals. [/quote]
THE PHARISEES asked questions and tested Our Lord all the time.

So what are saying you goin to write your bible?

[Brother Adam]

[quote name='Bruce S' date='Apr 9 2004, 02:55 PM']
Absolutely. Agreed.

So can formal groups too, and have, some have been whoppers.

Now, if you can just DEFINE the current commentary [or CCC] and say it is RIGHT, it solves that for the unthinking...

That is why the everyone needs a "Home Plate" that isn't constantly being rewritten by councils and encyclicals. [/quote]
I'm reading these documents now, and I don't see doctrine changing. Unlike, say, the SBC who does actually change doctrine. For instance, can you find a place in any of the 20 councils where Mary is declared the Mother of God and then find a place in a later council where Mary is declared not the Mother of God?

[Bruce S]

[quote]where Mary is declared the Mother of God and then find a place in a later council where Mary is declared not the Mother of God?
[/quote]

Mary is the mother of Jesus, sorry.

Now we can EXTEND that to God in the flesh, but making her the Mother of God, is rather to Mormonish for my taste.

If you want semanitics, go and TRY to follow this thread, it will make your nose bleed ... but look for the parallels to the thought process, deference to authority, and such.

Now this isn't about doctrine, just the way Mormons debate online...

[url="http://forums.christianity.com/?do=post_view_flat;post=896790;page=15;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;mh=50;"]http://forums.christianity.com/?do=post_vi...y;so=ASC;mh=50;[/url]

Ammon is a Mormon attorney from LA and is very smart.

[KennC]

Bruce;
[quote]Mary is the mother of Jesus, sorry.[/quote]
Jesus is not your Lord and your God? I should image you have been asked this a hundred times, .. I just get a kick out of Protestants who deny it. Carry on, and sorry to interupt.

Peace of Christ, Ken

[Livin_the_MASS]

"Mother of God
The reality and integrity of Christ's human nature is especially guaranteed by the fact that Christ was truly generated and born of a human mother. Through His descent from a daughter of Adam, He was, as to His humanity, incorporated into the posterity of Adam. He had identity of essence with man and community of race; Christ became our Brother.

The Church, in her Symbols of Faith, teaches that Christ was generated and born of the Virgin Mary, that is, out of the substance of the Virgin Mary. Reference the Apostles Creed "conceived by the Holy Ghost and born of the Virgin Mary." In both the Old and New Testaments the Messiah is designated as the posterity of Abraham and David (Genesis 22:18, Matthew 1:1, 9:27, 12:23, 22:42, Romans 1:2, 2 Timothy 2:8). The New Testament explicitly stresses the motherhood of Mary; Matthew 1:16 Mary "of whom Jesus was born;" Luke 1:31 "Behold thou shalt conceive in thy womb and shalt bring forth a son;" Galatians 4:4 "made of a woman;" Luke 1:43 "Mother of the Lord;" John 2:1 "Mother of Jesus;" and still others in the Gospel according to Matthew.

The Council of Ephesus in 431 with St. Cyril of Alexandria declared "If anyone does not confess that the Emmanuel (Christ) in truth is God and that on this account the Holy Virgin if the Mother of God (Theotokos) - since according to the flesh She brought forth the Word of God made flesh - let him be anathema."

From Chapter VIII of the Dogmatic Constitution of the Church
52. Wishing in his supreme goodness and wisdom to effect the redemption of the world, "when the fullness of time came, God sent his Son, born of a woman . . . that we might receive the adoption of sons" (Gal. 4:4). "He for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnated by the Holy Spirit from the Virgin Mary.'' This divine mystery of salvation is revealed to us and continued in the Church, which the Lord established as his body. Joined to Christ the head and in communion with all his saints, the faithful must in the first place reverence the memory "of the glorious ever Virgin Mary, Mother of God and of our Lord Jesus Christ."

Mary Mother of God want more go [url="http://www.ourladyswarriors.org/articles/mother.htm"]HERE!!![/url]
God Bless
Jason

[Hananiah]

If anyone wants to read the best Biblical commentary ever written, read [i]The Dialogue of St. Catherine of Sienna[/i]. God Himself interprets several passages from St. Paul's epistles.

[Hananiah]

[quote name='mulls' date='Apr 9 2004, 01:49 PM'] The Bible....


what about it needs to be interpreted? [/quote]
I'd say the histories and admonishions to live holily are clear enough for anyone to understand. Building doctrines from the Bible requires intelligence and a great amount of study. It also requires an infallible Church to put up fences around whatever paths lead to cliffs.

[Brother Adam]

Bruce,

Mormonism impresses me as much as those who can't think for themselves *cough*. The parallels are similiar, yes. Inductively studing the issue though shows that Mormonism is not Christianity while Catholicism preaches a true gospel.

I've had my fair share of debates with mormons. This laywers argument is full of holes. I'd like to see him and Carson Weber go a few rounds.

Naturally we all know though, the authority of our own knowledge is the only way to go

God bless Bruce

[Circle_Master]

if I may, I'm surprised no one has brought this up as of yet.

The first time the Bible refers to itself being interpreted is in Nehemiah 8:8. The passage says the following from the NASB translation :
[quote]They read from the book, from the law of God, translating to give the sense so that they understood the reading. [/quote]

This was done after the people returned from exile and the reasoning behind it is that the last generation that had lived in Israel had already died out. These were all new returnee's who had never seen Israel, or grown up in it's culture. What they interpreted for the people was how the culture and history of the previous Israel life affected the text and what it meant to them at this point. Sometimes we forget a step in our interpretations. We oftentimes go straight for the God --> Prophet --> Us and we forget that it is God --> Prophet --> Target Audience, and then we have to find out who the target audience was, and how they would receive it for --> Us to be tacked on.

So that would be the purpose of interpreting. We must figure out historically what is going on, and culturally, and then allow the text to speak to that time period and generation.

Common sense of course tells us that the farther back you go the more foggy it is, and oftentimes there are weird phrases and occurences in Scripture we cannot figure out. An instance of this would be 2 Kings 2:23-24 which says [quote]He went up from there to Bethel, and while he was going up on the way, some small boys came out of the city and jeered at him, saying, "Go up, you baldhead! Go up, you baldhead!" And he turned around, and when he saw them, he cursed them in the name of the LORD. And two she-bears came out of the woods and tore forty-two of the boys.[/quote]

That should be somewhat explanatory. Having bears maul kids for calling Elisha baldhead is a little odd. Check out "Hard sayings of the Old Testament" by Walter Kaiser for a suggested cultural understanding of that passage.