Pope Wants Crucifix At The Centre Of All Altars During Mass

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Winchester' date='03 February 2010 - 03:20 PM' timestamp='1265232006' post='2050646']
It's not always about you.
[/quote]
...but it IS always about my facial hair.

[quote name='Veridicus' date='03 February 2010 - 03:21 PM' timestamp='1265232072' post='2050648']
Semi-ovoid carpeted Sanctuaries are not conducive to altar rails. Which is why they have been designed that way for the last 40yrs.
[/quote]
It's sort of sad knowing that nothing short of a major reno could possibly make my Church 'perfect'.

Still, it's better than many in my diocese.

One that I sometimes go to got the whole 'whitewash' reno with industrial carpeting and beige walls a while ago.

Edited February 3, 2010 by Nihil Obstat

[Veridicus]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='03 February 2010 - 03:23 PM' timestamp='1265232204' post='2050651']
...but it IS always about my facial hair.


It's sort of sad knowing that nothing short of a major reno could possibly make my Church 'perfect'.

Still, it's better than many in my diocese.

One that I sometimes go to got the whole 'whitewash' reno with industrial carpeting and beige walls a while ago.
[/quote]

I find it somewhat disturbing to have carpet where the Precious Blood is being moved around. Of course I find glass chalices disturbing too but neither my opinion nor the USCCB's or the Vatican's statements will change what the local priest who threatens to retire decides to do. Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam, indeed.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Veridicus' date='03 February 2010 - 03:27 PM' timestamp='1265232443' post='2050658']
I find it somewhat disturbing to have carpet where the Precious Blood is being moved around. Of course I find glass chalices disturbing too but neither my opinion nor the USCCB's or the Vatican's statements will change what the local priest who threatens to retire decides to do. Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam, indeed.
[/quote]
Hm... never thought about it that way. Good point though.

[princessgianna]

[quote name='Apotheoun' date='09 January 2010 - 05:00 PM' timestamp='1263074417' post='2033418']
It would be better to simply make the celebration of the liturgy facing East the norm, and bring an end to the experiment of having the priest face the people.
[/quote]
Very true however in due time that will happen I am sure. If the Church went too fast, she would lose alot of people who would simply misunderstand the drastic* changes.

EDIT: *

Edited February 3, 2010 by princessgianna

[Nihil Obstat]

Luckily, orientation is probably the easiest of all these things to do.
After all, all the priest has to do is decide to face liturgical east. He'll explain why he does it when people ask, and that's it.
Easy.

I expect that it will become more common over the next 30 years.

[Veridicus]

[quote name='princessgianna' date='03 February 2010 - 03:46 PM' timestamp='1265233570' post='2050701']
Very true however in due time that will happen I am sure. If the Church went too fast, she would lose alot of people who would simply misunderstand the drastic* changes.

EDIT: *
[/quote]

Most people adjusted with Vat2. My mom said that was implemented pretty darn quick in Evansville. One year they were having Solemn High Masses and daily rosary. The next year they had Polka Masses and versus populum*.

Edited February 3, 2010 by Veridicus

[Veridicus]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='03 February 2010 - 03:47 PM' timestamp='1265233676' post='2050703']
Luckily, orientation is probably the easiest of all these things to do.
After all, all the priest has to do is decide to face liturgical east. He'll explain why he does it when people ask, and [s]that's it[/s] those people will start attending a church where the priest gives them more attention.
[s]Easy[/s]Really, Really, Really, Really hard.

I [s]expect [/s]hope and pray that it will become more common over the next 30 years.
[/quote]

There...fixed it for you.

[princessgianna]

[quote name='Veridicus' date='03 February 2010 - 04:50 PM' timestamp='1265233802' post='2050707']
Most people adjusted with Vat2. My mom said that was implemented pretty darn quick in Evansville. One year they were having Solemn High Masses and daily rosary. The next year they had Polka Masses and ad orientum.
[/quote]
With all due respect -most well meaning people left the Church!

In order for a change to truly be effective(generations wise)you have to allow time.

[StMichael]

To ensure the Church is strong, it would be better if it was smaller, obedient and the flock actually knew their faith as opposed to this largesse where we do not want to offend others who are more interested in making their impression on the Church and Mass.

From the hand holding to the lack of kneeling. To armies of Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion who dare to place a blessing on children. I could go on, including Deacon's self communicating and Priests taking secondary roles at the Mass.

The flock will follow, but the Bishops need to get a move on already. It was just 2 years ago that the Pope announced 19 errors in the Mass from the Latin and 16 were to be implemented.

Ah forget it, why even bother.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='StMichael' date='03 February 2010 - 04:33 PM' timestamp='1265236407' post='2050740']
To ensure the Church is strong, it would be better if it was smaller, obedient and the flock actually knew their faith as opposed to this largesse where we do not want to offend others who are more interested in making their impression on the Church and Mass.

From the hand holding to the lack of kneeling. To armies of Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion who dare to place a blessing on children. I could go on, including Deacon's self communicating and Priests taking secondary roles at the Mass.

The flock will follow, but the Bishops need to get a move on already. It was just 2 years ago that the Pope announced 19 errors in the Mass from the Latin and 16 were to be implemented.

Ah forget it, why even bother.
[/quote]
You get deacons?

The only time I've seen deacons at Mass in my diocese is at the EF (obviously) and at the ordination I went to. Oh, and my grad Mass. That was cool too.

[Veridicus]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='03 February 2010 - 05:13 PM' timestamp='1265238828' post='2050781']
You get deacons?

The only time I've seen deacons at Mass in my diocese is at the EF (obviously) and at the ordination I went to. Oh, and my grad Mass. That was cool too.
[/quote]

We might be a bit short on priest and conservatism in my part of the world, but we have been blessed with deacons in the last 15yrs. We had 12 men ordained to the Diaconate this last year. Deo gratias. Eases the burden on the priests a bit.

[Nihil Obstat]

My bishop I guess "opened up" the permanent diaconate a few years ago. I don't know how the response has been. I know we have some, because I saw a bunch of them in the summer... I just don't know where they are. My parish certainly didn't get any.

[Veridicus]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='03 February 2010 - 05:25 PM' timestamp='1265239534' post='2050798']
My bishop I guess "opened up" the permanent diaconate a few years ago. I don't know how the response has been. I know we have some, because I saw a bunch of them in the summer... I just don't know where they are. My parish certainly didn't get any.
[/quote]

Maybe permanent deacons are afraid of carpeted sanctuaries too.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Veridicus' date='03 February 2010 - 05:32 PM' timestamp='1265239953' post='2050804']
Maybe permanent deacons are afraid of carpeted sanctuaries too.
[/quote]
Hm...... that might be the case. Might certainly be the case.

Just makes one wish that all the priests were afraid of carpeted sanctuaries too...

[Veridicus]

[quote name='StMichael' date='03 February 2010 - 04:33 PM' timestamp='1265236407' post='2050740']
From the hand holding...
[/quote]

I share your frustrations. Cappie posted a great link to a [url="http://www.canonlaw.info/liturgysacraments_orans.htm"]webpage[/url] when I questioned about this on Q&A. It poses a very simple solution: have the priest stop using the Orans stance during the Our Father since during the Pater Noster of the OF the priest is not 'praying on behalf of the people' but with them. At pretty much every other time the priest uses the orans pose, he is praying for the people while they are silent.