Is Islam A Religion Of Truth, Peace And Love Or Not?

[Apotheoun]

Maggie, I am shocked at your intolerance.

Edited December 11, 2009 by Apotheoun

[JimR-OCDS]

The Catholic Church certainly has its sins of the past, for which Pope John Paul II apologized.

However, I think the Church has evolve spiritually over the centuries since its conception and I think it was
the reformation which forced the Church to evolve.


I don't think I can say the same for Islam. However, perhaps the current times we live in, are the deigning of a turning point which will trigger a Islamic-reformation, where Muslims will
begin to reject intolerance.

That being said. Lets pray that Christianity doesn't digress backwards, which can happen very easily,
especially as fundamentalism has been trying to take control of the Catholic Church.

Jim

Edited December 11, 2009 by JimR-OCDS

[Varg]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='11 December 2009 - 01:26 PM' timestamp='1260555982' post='2018502']
The Catholic Church certainly has its sins of the past, for which Pope John Paul II apologized.
[/quote]
Apologies can't bring people back to life.

[Socrates]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='11 December 2009 - 01:26 PM' timestamp='1260555982' post='2018502']
The Catholic Church certainly has its sins of the past, for which Pope John Paul II apologized.

However, I think the Church has evolve spiritually over the centuries since its conception and I think it was
the reformation which forced the Church to evolve.


I don't think I can say the same for Islam. However, perhaps the current times we live in, are the deigning of a turning point which will trigger a Islamic-reformation, where Muslims will
begin to reject intolerance.

That being said. Lets pray that Christianity doesn't digress backwards, which can happen very easily,
especially as fundamentalism has been trying to take control of the Catholic Church.

Jim
[/quote]
Well, actually, the Catholic Church, as the Mystical Bride of Christ, does not sin, but its members, being fallen human beings, do.

That said, what do you mean by "evolve spiritually," and what do you think the Church is "evolving" into?
The truths taught by the Church do not change, but remain timeless.

And what exactly is this "fundamentalism" which you claim "has been trying to take control of the Catholic Church"?
Who are the "fundamentalists" you refer to?

[Winchester]

Poor history and worse catechesis.

[JimR-OCDS]

[quote name='Varg' date='11 December 2009 - 02:56 PM' timestamp='1260557762' post='2018522']
Apologies can't bring people back to life.
[/quote]


No, but its a step toward healing and setting an example, of how to treat others.


Jim

[Winchester]

[quote name='Varg' date='11 December 2009 - 01:56 PM' timestamp='1260557762' post='2018522']
Apologies can't bring people back to life.
[/quote]
You're obviously rotten at apologizing.

[JimR-OCDS]

Socrates


[quote]
Well, actually, the Catholic Church, as the Mystical Bride of Christ, does not sin, but its members, being fallen human beings, do.
[/quote]

True, but the members make up the body of Christ, which is the Church. When the members sin, it harms the Church.

[quote]
That said, what do you mean by "evolve spiritually," and what do you think the Church is "evolving" into?
[/quote]

The Church as an institution, no longer burns heretics at the stake. She no longer forces conversion, etc.

Teilhard De Chardin, wrote on the spiritual evolution of the Church. Just as man evolved biologically, so too, he evolve spiritually. The Church is responsible for bring man through that spiritual evolution.

[quote]
The truths taught by the Church do not change, but remain timeless.
[/quote]

Our understanding of truth evolves and how we bring that truth to the world does as well.

[quote]
And what exactly is this "fundamentalism" which you claim "has been trying to take control of the Catholic Church"?
[/quote]

Fundamentalism is when a person reads either the Bible, or in the case with Catholics, the Catechism or other Church teachings, and takes them literally as he/she understands them, not as the Church teaches them.

[quote]
Who are the "fundamentalists"
you refer to?
[/quote]


So use the definition I heard Pastor Rick Warren use, a fundamentalist, is one who has stopped listening.

Jim

Edited December 11, 2009 by JimR-OCDS

[Winchester]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='11 December 2009 - 03:48 PM' timestamp='1260564495' post='2018602']
The Church as an institution, no longer burns heretics at the stake. She no longer forces conversion, etc.
[/quote]
The Church never burned people at the stake. That was the government's penalty.

Where were conversions forced by the Church (not members, but the Church. I'm certain there will be Church documents pertaining to it).

[Apotheoun]

That definition could apply in lots of situations

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='11 December 2009 - 01:48 PM' timestamp='1260564495' post='2018602']
So use the definition I heard Pastor Rick Warren use, a modern dissenter, is one who has stopped listening.[/quote]

[JimR-OCDS]

[quote name='Winchester' date='11 December 2009 - 04:50 PM' timestamp='1260564656' post='2018605']
The Church never burned people at the stake. That was the government's penalty.

Where were conversions forced by the Church (not members, but the Church. I'm certain there will be Church documents pertaining to it).
[/quote]


The Church played no part in it? [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/lol_roll.gif[/img]


Jim

[Winchester]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='11 December 2009 - 03:53 PM' timestamp='1260564821' post='2018608']
The Church played no part in it? [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/lol_roll.gif[/img]


Jim
[/quote]
The Church did not do it. Your argument was that the Church did not do it. Your argument was incorrect because you were unaware of history. The Church herself does not evolve. The Church herself does not sin. If you learned the proper terminology, you would have fewer problems. If you accepted proper correction, you would make a better impression. I speak from experience.

[Jaime]

[quote name='sacredheartandbloodofjesus' date='11 December 2009 - 12:08 AM' timestamp='1260508102' post='2018198']
Apo wanted me to start this poll to test phatmassers Faith, in whether we accept Islam or Catholicism......
[/quote]

That would be about the silliest thing I've read today

[Winchester]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='11 December 2009 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1260565186' post='2018615']
That would be about the silliest thing I've read today
[/quote]
I consider that a challenge, sir.

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='hot stuff' date='11 December 2009 - 01:59 PM' timestamp='1260565186' post='2018615']
That would be about the silliest thing I've read today
[/quote]
Actually, it is Sacredheart who asked me if any Phatmassers had accepted Muslim doctrines, and I told him I have no idea if there are any, but that he could create a poll if he wanted (see [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=101137&view=findpost&p=2018307"]Post#11[/url]). Evidently he wanted to create a poll.

Edited December 11, 2009 by Apotheoun