Muslims On Flight Cause Panic

[mortify]

[quote name='extempers' date='10 December 2009 - 09:19 PM' timestamp='1260497991' post='2018043']
I suggest doing some serious reading on the subject before making such mediocre and well-refuted claims.
Jihadwatch is not serious reading [/quote]

Ya akhi, why do you presume me to be an ignorant kafir? I once practiced your deen. I don't need to refer to some tertiary resource, the Sahih Hadith record your Rasul's evil deeds.

[Pomak]

[quote name='Apotheoun' date='11 December 2009 - 05:15 AM' timestamp='1260468905' post='2017594']
It is unlikely that a person will find any statistics on the number of terrorist attacks perpetrated by Muslims, because to collect information of that kind in Western countries is held to be politically incorrect.
[/quote]

That book I mentioned, dying to win, is exactly that. It found that Muslims were not the majority, just sizable minority. It also looks at the way to judge terrorism, if using religion to explain it is best way or if using geo-political factors is. (There is a tendency for terrorism to rear its head when a country is occupied)

As NAS said "I can show them n***** the water but I can't make them drink.

[extempers]

[quote name='HisChildForever' date='10 December 2009 - 09:26 PM' timestamp='1260498376' post='2018047']
Robert Spencer is a brilliant man with outstanding credentials.
[/quote]
Yup, David Duke is "brilliant" too. I wonder how much of Spencer you have actually read or does his "well cited" arguments fit your narrative against Islam so well that there's no questioning his authority?

It was sad when I was working at Borders and non-handicapped people were buying his books in audio.
Have we really gotten to that level?


[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' date='10 December 2009 - 09:27 PM' timestamp='1260498422' post='2018048']
Look at Hitler's religious beliefs in the period of 1943-1945 and then say that he didn't use his "Christianity" as a simple means of appealing to the Germans and getting ahead in the political game.
[/quote]

Yes, that is the counter-argument. But did Hitler use his hands to execute 12 million people and millions more on the battlefield? Who are the real killers?
And what of the Pope during this time? His lack of public condemnation as well as denying the escape of Jews to South America are not exactly conducive to the idea that Christianity played no part in Nazism.

Allahu Alim (God knows best). These are not important points. We can play the blame game and the number game as well, but the real argument is that Christian hands have been bloody for many centuries and continue to be so and while there are political and ideological reasons for many atrocities, the same excuse must be applied to Muslims of today.

Go live in Gaza for a few years and tell me how things work out. And yes, there ARE Christians in Gaza. I'll never forget reading how they forgot about Orthodox Christmas during the massacre.
Christmas season is here for you all. Can you imagine the situation is so bad that you FORGET Christmas?

SubhanAllah (All Glory belongs to God).

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='extempers' date='10 December 2009 - 09:47 PM' timestamp='1260499634' post='2018068']
Yup, David Duke is "brilliant" too. I wonder how much of Spencer you have actually read or does his "well cited" arguments fit your narrative against Islam so well that there's no questioning his authority?

It was sad when I was working at Borders and non-handicapped people were buying his books in audio.
Have we really gotten to that level?

[/quote]

Are you making a personal attack against my character by suggesting that I must be handicapped since I like Spencer, while simultaneously insulting those who do have either a mental or physical handicap?

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='extempers' date='10 December 2009 - 09:47 PM' timestamp='1260499634' post='2018068']
Yes, that is the counter-argument. But did Hitler use his hands to execute 12 million people and millions more on the battlefield? Who are the real killers?
And what of the Pope during this time? His lack of public condemnation as well as denying the escape of Jews to South America are not exactly conducive to the idea that Christianity played no part in Nazism.

Allahu Alim (God knows best). These are not important points. We can play the blame game and the number game as well, but the real argument is that Christian hands have been bloody for many centuries and continue to be so and while there are political and ideological reasons for many atrocities, the same excuse must be applied to Muslims of today.

Go live in Gaza for a few years and tell me how things work out. And yes, there ARE Christians in Gaza. I'll never forget reading how they forgot about Orthodox Christmas during the massacre.
Christmas season is here for you all. Can you imagine the situation is so bad that you FORGET Christmas?

SubhanAllah (All Glory belongs to God).
[/quote]
The question, then, is: Does Christianity kill people? Or do Christians kill people?

[extempers]

[quote name='mortify' date='10 December 2009 - 09:31 PM' timestamp='1260498674' post='2018054']
Ya akhi, why do you presume me to be an ignorant kafir? I once practiced your deen. I don't need to refer to some tertiary resource, the Sahih Hadith record your Rasul's evil deeds.
[/quote]

Ya akhi ibn Addam, are you majnuuna? How sad you have sold your tawheed for shirk, your eemaan for the promises of waswas, your Haqq for baatil.
Allah guides Whom He Wills. May Allah open your qalb to Islam and give you hidayah.
Ameen ya Rabbil Alameen.


So how far practicing were you? What seerah books did you read? Enlighten me with your erudition.

[Hassan]

[quote name='Apotheoun' date='10 December 2009 - 01:15 PM' timestamp='1260468905' post='2017594']
It is unlikely that a person will find any statistics on the number of terrorist attacks perpetrated by Muslims, because to collect information of that kind in Western countries is held to be politically incorrect.
[/quote]


You haven't done a lot of work in any of the social sciences.

[mortify]

[quote name='extempers' date='10 December 2009 - 09:52 PM' timestamp='1260499970' post='2018077']
Ya akhi ibn Addam, are you majnuuna? How sad you have sold your tawheed for shirk, your eemaan for the promises of waswas, your Haqq for baatil.
Allah guides Whom He Wills. May Allah open your qalb to Islam and give you hidayah.
Ameen ya Rabbil Alameen.


So how far practicing were you? What seerah books did you read? Enlighten me with your erudition.
[/quote]

God does guide, He guided me to Siratul Mustaqeem which is the Lord Jesus Christ, who said "I am al-Haqq" and "I am the Way."

So now the interest is on me? Tell me akhi, do the Seerat deny that Muhammad permitted the rape of captured women of war?

[extempers]

[quote name='HisChildForever' date='10 December 2009 - 09:49 PM' timestamp='1260499788' post='2018072']
Are you making a personal attack against my character by suggesting that I must be handicapped since I like Spencer, while simultaneously insulting those who do have either a mental or physical handicap?
[/quote]
Are you still trying the "he's Muslim, he must be insulting me" card while still not apologizing for your outrageous statements of the past?

Getting old.

I would have a problem with a blind person buying his books, but not at the same level as I would with a person with all his/her faculties working and relying on an audio book.
And that is why I wrote non-handicapped. But good try my sister in humanity!

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' date='10 December 2009 - 09:50 PM' timestamp='1260499826' post='2018074']
The question, then, is: Does Christianity kill people? Or do Christians kill people?
[/quote]
Indeed that is the question. Last semester I took a high level seminar "War, Empire and Ethics" class. I wasn't expecting it, but the majority of the primary sources were the Bible, famous Christian scholars and church resolution like from the mennonites.

One second I'm reading Aquinas and its all good and next second BAM Catholic church releases statements allowing for almost any action to stop nuclear threats.

The problem is that the message of Jesus (as) was confined to a particular time and people and revelations regarding involvement in warfare were not given to him like they were given to Moses (as) and Muhammad (s), so what do Christians do?

All rules of engagement, combat and just war theory are conjecture from the church and its scholars with severe disagreement over time. One would cannot deny the stance of Aquinas regarding warfare is nowhere close to what is the current position of the Catholic church, although their allowance for differing opinions might be cited.

In Islam, explicit rules are given to such detail that we know we can't even harm crops/trees in warfare!

We know our just war theory, our rules of engagement and it is all backed by example.
Given, there are groups who have abandoned all these rules and have declared jihad on their own.
But if you've studied Islamic just war theory, you know that only the leader of the Muslim state can call for jihad.

So to answer your question, it's a problem with Christianity as well as with Christians.

[Nihil Obstat]

People buy audio books for reasons other than disabilities. That's a very ignorant comment.

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='extempers' date='10 December 2009 - 10:07 PM' timestamp='1260500877' post='2018087']
Are you still trying the "he's Muslim, he must be insulting me" card while still not apologizing for your outrageous statements of the past?

Getting old. [/quote]

I am not going to apologize for posting historical facts about Muhammad.

[extempers]

[quote name='mortify' date='10 December 2009 - 10:02 PM' timestamp='1260500558' post='2018084']
God does guide, He guided me to Siratul Mustaqeem which is the Lord Jesus Christ, who said "I am al-Haqq" and "I am the Way."

So now the interest is on me? Tell me akhi, do the Seerat deny that Muhammad permitted the rape of captured women of war?
[/quote]

And Jesus (as) is, but he is no ilah let alone Allah (swt). The interest is only for your sake, so no worries.

Seerat? I'm guessing you are desi? Pakistani perhaps?

And when did everyone start copying my style of answering a question with a question? Lol, I guess I deserve it.

Tell me the seerah books you have read and your level of knowledge in Islam before we have any discussion.
It's based on this that I will address your claims.
Were you an actual talib ilm or just a typical layman with cursory knowledge of Islam.

With all respect, it seems like the latter if you are claiming rape.

[extempers]

[quote name='HisChildForever' date='10 December 2009 - 10:12 PM' timestamp='1260501146' post='2018091']
I am not going to apologize for posting historical facts about Muhammad.
[/quote]
Growing stuff is a historical fact?
Really?


Ah well, alhamdillah for discussion.

[mortify]

[quote name='extempers' date='10 December 2009 - 10:13 PM' timestamp='1260501224' post='2018092']
With all respect, it seems like the latter if you are claiming rape.
[/quote]

Are you saying Muhammad did not permit rape of captured women?

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='extempers' date='10 December 2009 - 10:13 PM' timestamp='1260501224' post='2018092']
And when did everyone start copying my style of answering a question with a question?
[/quote]
[size="1"]Jesus did it first.[/size]