The Liturgy Of The Hours Is Missing Verses!

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='30 November 2009 - 07:02 AM' timestamp='1259589734' post='2011900']
Jesus message was contrary to this. However, Jesus also revealed God the Father in a way King David, who wrote the Psalms, would not have imagined.

Jesus contradicted the mandates from Scripture that adulterers were to be stoned. That Jews were not to defile themselves by eating and drinking with sinners.

Again, the context from which they were written is important, and the difference of how WE, as Christians pray with the Psalms, is different than the that of the ancient Hebrews, because of what Jesus revealed to us a God of mercy.

If you're going to follow the Old Testament literally, without the revelation of the Gospel message, than you'll have to include the dietary laws as well as the legalistic laws of the OT.

I prefer to follow the Gospel and so does the Catholic Church, who authorized the LOTH.[/quote]
Certainly Christians are not under the Law, because Christ fufilled it, but your post sounds a bit Marcionite.

[JimR-OCDS]

[quote name='Apotheoun' date='30 November 2009 - 02:12 PM' timestamp='1259604735' post='2012011']
Certainly Christians are not under the Law, because Christ fufilled it, but your post sounds a bit Marcionite.
[/quote]


Not at all.

Neither myself nor the Church reject the Old Testament in favor of the New Testament, but understand the OT in relation to Gospel, as taught by Jesus and the Apostles.

The Liturgy of the Hours is prayer, which draws us toward God, who dwells within. We don't just
say the Divine Office, but rather, we pray it.

Psalm 58, in the opinion of the Church, does not equal prayer in this sense and is probably why they left this and some parts of the Psalms, out of the LOTH.



Jim

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='30 November 2009 - 11:39 AM' timestamp='1259606371' post='2012024']
Not at all.

Neither myself nor the Church reject the Old Testament in favor of the New Testament, but understand the OT in relation to Gospel, as taught by Jesus and the Apostles.

The Liturgy of the Hours is prayer, which draws us toward God, who dwells within. We don't just
say the Divine Office, but rather, we pray it.

Psalm 58, in the opinion of the Church, does not equal prayer in this sense and is probably why they left this and some parts of the Psalms, out of the LOTH.



Jim
[/quote]
Thank you for the clarification. Your earlier post made it sound as if Psalm 58 was not inspired by the Holy Trinity, and that is why I posted the comment about Marcionism.

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='30 November 2009 - 11:39 AM' timestamp='1259606371' post='2012024']
Psalm 58, in the opinion of the Church, does not equal prayer in this sense and is probably why they left this and some parts of the Psalms, out of the LOTH.[/quote]
The Melkite Catholic Church continues to recite Psalm 58 as a part of the Liturgy of the Hours, and so by the phrase "the Church" I think you actually mean to say "the Roman Church."

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Theoketos' date='29 November 2009 - 07:23 PM' timestamp='1259547816' post='2011592']
It is in the four volume version.
[/quote]
I just looked through my four volume Roman Rite Liturgy of the Hours and it does not contain psalms 58, 83, or 109. When was your version published? Mine was published in 1976, but perhaps they have been added back into the psalter in a later edition.

Edited November 30, 2009 by Apotheoun

[JimR-OCDS]

[quote name='Apotheoun' date='30 November 2009 - 02:56 PM' timestamp='1259607407' post='2012038']
The Melkite Catholic Church continues to recite Psalm 58 as a part of the Liturgy of the Hours, and so by the phrase "the Church" I think you actually mean to say "the Roman Church."
[/quote]


Correct, and I will add, its the LOTH of the Latin Rite, which is predominately written for the Western Mindset.

Jim

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='Lil Red' date='29 November 2009 - 08:18 PM' timestamp='1259543903' post='2011555']
+J.M.J.+
statements like these only divide. statements like these really tick me off. don't belittle those of us who legitimately use the English LOTH and have no desire to pray the office in Latin.
[/quote]
The false dichotomy of OF and Latin really tick [i]me [/i]off. I met a priest who prays the OF office in Latin.

[quote name='Veridicus' date='29 November 2009 - 08:31 PM' timestamp='1259544687' post='2011563']
Those statements may just reveal some divides that are extant rather than themselves dividing anything.
[/quote]
Yes.

[quote name='Resurrexi' date='30 November 2009 - 02:07 AM' timestamp='1259564839' post='2011830']
I didn't mean to belittle anyone.

Also, only those under obligation to recite the office (e.g. clerics) have to pray the 1962 Breviary in Latin. Everyone else is free to pray an English translation.
[/quote]
Wait... what? You sure you got this right?

[JimR-OCDS]

I'm under obligation to recite the Morning and Evening prayers of the Divine Office, and I'm not required to use the 1962 Breviary in Latin.

Jim

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Sacred Music Man' date='01 December 2009 - 12:16 AM' timestamp='1259644572' post='2012381']
The false dichotomy of OF and Latin really tick [i]me [/i]off. I met a priest who prays the OF office in Latin.


Yes.


Wait... what? You sure you got this right?
[/quote]

Yes, I'm sure. Only those who have an obligation to recite the Office every day must say the EF Office in Latin. (Even then, there were often indults for priets to say the ancient Roman Office in the vernacular duing the mid-20th century.) Those who are praying it merely out of devotion are free to pray a vernacular translation if they so prefer.

Edited December 1, 2009 by Resurrexi

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='JimR-OCDS' date='01 December 2009 - 03:37 PM' timestamp='1259699826' post='2012648']
I'm under obligation to recite the Morning and Evening prayers of the Divine Office, and I'm not required to use the 1962 Breviary in Latin.

Jim
[/quote]

But you, like every other Latin under obligation to pray the Office, are free to use the extraordinary form thereof if you so desire.

[Apotheoun]

I thought that Resurrexi was referring to priests who belong to certain societies (e.g., the FSSP).

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Apotheoun' date='01 December 2009 - 03:54 PM' timestamp='1259700895' post='2012661']
I thought that Resurrexi was referring to priests who belong to certain societies (e.g., the FSSP).
[/quote]

Any Latin priest can use the EF Office to fulfill his obligation, even those who do not belong to a society dedicated to the use of the EF liturgical books. Of course, any priest who is saying the EF office in order to fulfill his obligation needs to say if in Latin.