Confession Taped

[BG45]

http://wdtprs.com/blog/2009/11/priestpenitent-privilege-and-a-states-violation-of-the-seal/

[quote]Seal of Confession Goes on Trial

Church and State Face Off in Court

By Annamarie Adkins

SALEM, Oregon, AUG. 26, 2009 (Zenit.org).- When Father Timothy Mockaitis heard inmate Conan Wayne Hale’s sacramental confession on April 22, 1996, he had no idea it was being recorded.

He also didn’t know that the event would spur an unprecedented legal case that attempted to demonstrate that a violation of the seal of the confessional was an infringement on the free exercise of religion guaranteed by the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

Father Mockaitis details these pivotal events in his new book, “The Seal: A Priest’s Story.” The pastor of Queen of Peace Catholic Church shared with ZENIT how this case involved not only canon law versus civil law, but also a threat to the long term viability of our Constitutional freedoms.

ZENIT: You filed a lawsuit to prevent disclosure of the contents of the confession. What were your legal claims?

Father Mockaitis: Our legal position was based essentially on First and Fourth Amendment violations, which concern religious freedom and protections against illegal search and seizure.

We also claimed civil rights violations against privacy. This was an offense against not only the Church, but against the penitent himself.

But we also raised moral and ethical objections that this particular and deliberate intrusion by the state was one incident that could never be justified for a greater good.

The integrity of both the Constitution and an unmistakable explanation of Canon Law, and the centuries-old tradition of the Church about the absolute secrecy of the seal in the sacrament of reconciliation, were all presented in this case.

It was the first time an attempt was made in court to define a violation of the seal of confession as a First Amendment violation.

The state consistently claimed the tape as among the body of evidence in its investigation.

A priest comes to the confessional in a parish church, a jail cell or a hospital bedside not as a judge and jury, but as a pastor of souls.

The actions of the state, and the response of the Archdiocese of Portland, set up a never-before-test of the American Constitution. I felt state authorities had backed themselves into an untenable legal corner.[/quote]

And for those who want it:
http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/c/F3/104/104.F3d.1522.96-35901.html It was decided over ten years ago, however the tape has still not been destroyed.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='BG45' date='24 November 2009 - 02:47 PM' timestamp='1259095651' post='2008655']
http://wdtprs.com/blog/2009/11/priestpenitent-privilege-and-a-states-violation-of-the-seal/



And for those who want it:
http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/c/F3/104/104.F3d.1522.96-35901.html It was decided over ten years ago, however the tape has still not been destroyed.
[/quote]
+JMJ+
thanks for sharing this!

[BG45]

Quite welcome, the full interview is well worth the read! (As are the editorial comments put in to them, I removed a handful in that snippet)

[Lil Red]

+J.M.J.+
what i find interesting is the groups in support of the plaintiffs:
[quote]Mark E. Chopko, Jeffrey Hunter Moon, Washington, D.C., for amicus curiae United States Catholic Conference, National Council of Churches of Christ in the U.S.A., Christian Legal Society, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Clifton Kirkpatrick, as Stated Clerk of the General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.), The American Jewish Congress, The Commission on Social Action of Reform Judaism, The Baptist Joint Committee on Public Affairs, and the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America, in the Support of the plaintiffs-appellants.[/quote]

[Lil Red]

+JMJ+
question: if a priest is uncomfortable/unwilling to administer the sacrament of Confession in a jail (for fear of it being taped), what about those souls who desire to go to Confession but can't?

[Lounge Daddy]

The Soviet KGB used to have Russian Orthodox priests who would report on anything heard in a confessional that might be deemed an offence against the State. is this the direction the U.S.A. is heading?

[sacredheartandbloodofjesus]

[quote name='Lounge Daddy' date='24 November 2009 - 06:44 PM' timestamp='1259106281' post='2008779']
The Soviet KGB used to have Russian Orthodox priests who would report on anything heard in a confessional that might be deemed an offence against the State. is this the direction the U.S.A. is heading?
[/quote]


Are you serious I never knew that, thats just sickening.

[Brother Adam]

[quote name='Lounge Daddy' date='24 November 2009 - 07:44 PM' timestamp='1259106281' post='2008779']
The Soviet KGB used to have Russian Orthodox priests who would report on anything heard in a confessional that might be deemed an offence against the State. is this the direction the U.S.A. is heading?
[/quote]

A priest realizes the penalty he is under for doing that in the Catholic Church. Any priest worth anything would choose martyrdom before breaking his sacramental seal.

[CatherineM]

Maybe they will have to do it by passing notes and then eating them.

[BG45]

Good question Red...

As to the "is this the direction America is heading", this did take place ten years ago. The tape hasn't been destroyed.

[Apotheoun]

From 1917 to 1935 approximately 130,000 Russian Orthodox priests were arrested by the Bolsheviks, and more than 90,000 of those men were killed, and during that same period hundreds of thousands of nuns were sent to gulags, where no doubt the vast majority of them died.

In 1917 there were more than 29,000 Russian Orthodox Churches in Russia, but by 1935 the number had been reduced to 500.

God forbid that such a persecution ever happen in the United States.


[b]Icon of the New Martyrs, Confessors, and Passion-Bearers of Russia[/b]

[img]http://www.allsaintsofamerica.org/martyrs/images/nmrc.jpg[/img]

Pray for us, O Holy Martyrs, Confessors and Passion-Bearers of Russia.

Edited November 25, 2009 by Apotheoun

[BG45]

The name of the island is escaping me right now Apotheoun, but perhaps you would know. There was a vision by the Blessed Virgin saying the place would be a new Golgotha and then it was where the Bolsheviks sent the clergy to die in a gulag...

Edit: Solovki in the Solovetsky Islands I believe?

Edited November 25, 2009 by BG45

[Apotheoun]

[url="http://merecomments.typepad.com/merecomments/2009/08/from-gulag-to-spiritual-center.html"]From Gulag to Spiritual Center[/url]

[BG45]

Thank you, a good end for a place of such horror.

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='Apotheoun' date='24 November 2009 - 10:46 PM' timestamp='1259117174' post='2008955']
[url="http://merecomments.typepad.com/merecomments/2009/08/from-gulag-to-spiritual-center.html"]From Gulag to Spiritual Center[/url]
[/quote]

From the link: "Kirill presented an icon of the Mother of God as a gift to the "Dmitry Donskoi" and small images of Christ to those on the vessel."

Perhaps the Russians will look upon those images and think twice about their service of turning the keys that unleash MIRV-laden nuclear missiles from their boomers, aimed at United State cities.

~Sternhauser

Edited November 25, 2009 by Sternhauser