Lil Red Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 +J.M.J.+ should a woman who veils at Mass not wear pants to Mass (or at all)? honest question that was posed to me "why veil the head yet expose the crotch?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 Did you just combine the two most controversial topics EVER into one monster topic? *runs and hides* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varg Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 If someone wants to go commando then I say let 'em Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zunshynn Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 Is anyone's argument against pants that they "expose the crotch"? Personally I prefer skirts and dresses at Mass, and in general, actually... but that's just me... and I do veil. But I don't think pants are immodest or inappropriate for mass, as long as they're nice (there are, after all, some very feminine pants out there... sometime more feminine than skirts that I've seen) and I definitely don't think it's at odds with veiling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totus Tuus Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='09 November 2009 - 04:09 PM' timestamp='1257800984' post='1999018'] Did you just combine the two most controversial topics EVER into one monster topic? *runs and hides* [/quote] Yeah, I thought it was a joke when I saw the title. Anyway, this is an interesting question. It's along the lines of "if you're going to eat a big mac don't have it with a diet coke". My personal opinion is that you don't have to go all or nothing. I think someone can sincerely believe that pants are appropriate for Mass and be a veil-wearer at the same time. It all comes down to not knowing an individual's heart. There is a reason the church doesn't proclaim/reiterate (depending on your view) these kinds of teachings and I think we need to take that to heart. Clearly it shouldn't be a matter of division among us. At least, it's clear to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 [quote name='Lil Red' date='09 November 2009 - 04:07 PM' timestamp='1257800846' post='1999016'] "why veil the head yet expose the crotch?" [/quote] ROFLLLL! Not sure how wearing pants "exposes the crotch" lol I'm pretty sure pants cover all necessary parts lol at least all pants I've ever seen. I don't see a problem with women wearing pants even if the veil. The strongest argument, from Scripture, that could possibly be interpreted against women wearing pants is Deut 22:5 (The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.) Now exegetically speaking, the verse says women shouldn't wear things made for a man and a man shouldn't wear things made for a woman. So men shouldn't wear clothing that is made strictly for women - ie pants made for a woman and women shouldn't wear clothing made for men - ie pants made for a man. If a piece of clothing is made for a particular sex, and as long as it is modest, there shouldn't be an issue over that sex wearing that particular piece of clothing. Think about the time in which Deut. was written. Women and men wore similar clothing (robes). Women didn't wear men's robes and men didn't wear women's robes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted November 9, 2009 Author Share Posted November 9, 2009 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='09 November 2009 - 03:09 PM' timestamp='1257800984' post='1999018'] Did you just combine the two most controversial topics EVER into one monster topic? *runs and hides* [/quote] +J.M.J.+ yes, i did. and phatmass did not blow up, as previously thought. i'm so dead serious. this women posited that up until 1910, when women started wearing pants and you could see between their legs, that was the start of the moral decline: contraception, and abortion, etc followed. that if women want to reclaim their dignity, that women should wear skirts/dresses. in our discussion, (it was at Bible study), we did talk about the fact that more modesty is needed in our society. then we discussed veiling at Mass. she said to me "well, why veil (cover up) your head if you are going to expose your crotch (by wearing pants)?" needless to say i was a little upset and retorted with "and do you know what i wear to Mass?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted November 9, 2009 Author Share Posted November 9, 2009 [quote name='StColette' date='09 November 2009 - 03:21 PM' timestamp='1257801676' post='1999027'] ROFLLLL! Not sure how wearing pants "exposes the crotch" lol I'm pretty sure pants cover all necessary parts lol at least all pants I've ever seen. [/quote] +J.M.J.+ because by wearing pants, you can tell that women have crotches? honestly, i have no idea where she was going with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 [quote name='Lil Red' date='09 November 2009 - 04:29 PM' timestamp='1257802180' post='1999032'] +J.M.J.+ because by wearing pants, you can tell that women have crotches? honestly, i have no idea where she was going with this. [/quote] ROFL! nvm...not going to say it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picchick Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 Well, as I have read before, the purpose of veiling is less about modesty and more about showing our role within the Church. Pants vs. skirt really doesn't show our role within the Church. Rrather, it is more of fashion and modesty situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IcePrincessKRS Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 [quote name='Lil Red' date='09 November 2009 - 05:28 PM' timestamp='1257802101' post='1999030'] +J.M.J.+ yes, i did. and phatmass did not blow up, as previously thought. i'm so dead serious. this women posited that up until 1910, when women started wearing pants and you could see between their legs, that was the start of the moral decline: contraception, and abortion, etc followed. that if women want to reclaim their dignity, that women should wear skirts/dresses. in our discussion, (it was at Bible study), we did talk about the fact that more modesty is needed in our society. then we discussed veiling at Mass. she said to me "well, why veil (cover up) your head if you are going to expose your crotch (by wearing pants)?" needless to say i was a little upset and retorted with "and do you know what i wear to Mass?" [/quote] Did anyone point out to her that those things existed well before 1910? There was plenty of sinning and debauchery well before women started wearing pants. What does she think went on in ol' Sodom and Gomorrah? How about the ancient Greeks? Has she read Canterbury tales? Loads of immoral behaviors and women were still wearing skirts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 the Bible says to veil, it doesn't say not to wear pants. by her logic, the veil itself exposes the woman's hair, because it's obviously in the shape of the woman's hair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted November 9, 2009 Author Share Posted November 9, 2009 [quote name='IcePrincessKRS' date='09 November 2009 - 03:42 PM' timestamp='1257802924' post='1999046'] Did anyone point out to her that those things existed well before 1910? There was plenty of sinning and debauchery well before women started wearing pants. What does she think went on in ol' Sodom and Gomorrah? How about the ancient Greeks? Has she read Canterbury tales? Loads of immoral behaviors and women were still wearing skirts. [/quote] +J.M.J.+ her position is thus: before 1910 in the fashion of any time, you could never see between a woman's legs (as pants show them), which therefore lead to the downfall of the dignity of women as we know it today (and thus the immodest fashions we see of today). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picchick Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 yet prostitution, abortion, fornication, immodesty all existed well before 1910. It just wasn't talked about as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morostheos Posted November 9, 2009 Share Posted November 9, 2009 [quote name='picchick' date='09 November 2009 - 05:55 PM' timestamp='1257803726' post='1999059'] yet prostitution, abortion, fornication, immodesty all existed well before 1910. It just wasn't talked about as much. [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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