InHisLove726 Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Hello, pham. I'm curious to know if anyone has ever visited the Carmelites in Terre Haute, IN? What drew you to them? How was your time spent while you were there? I'm also curious about live-ins. I am asking this purely for informational purposes as I am discerning with another Carmelite community, but I find myself drawn to their website over and over again. Thanks for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indwelling Trinity Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) Terre Haute is a beautiful Carmel, but a very busy one. They are 1991 constituions and as i know of still retain the full habit. Many of the sisters are skilled artisans I beleive. I too way back when in the past was very drawn to them but wound up entering Port Tobacco in Maryland where the former Prioress, Mother Mary Joseph was from Terre Haute. Mother has since recently gone on to her reward. Port Tobacco was also a beautiful Carmel in which the sisters lived in separate hermitages, although they still follow the 1991 constitutions. The novices live their first years in a novitiate before going to the hermitages. However except for one hermit day a week the life is as a 1991 Carmel. Mother Virginia marie was my novice Mistress at Port Tobacco and is celebrating her 75 anniversary today. she is a sprightly beautiful soul. Terre Haute belongs to the Queen of Carmel Association and Port Tobacco belongs to the Teresian Association. They are both more flexible in following the 1991 constitutions as oppose to the more structured 1990 constitutions. They are both good Carmels for those who wish more middle of the road expression of Carmel. Both wear full habit. But like every institution you will not find perfection as we are all human. I do not know who the Prioress is now at Terre Haute. They may have slowed down some but i am not sure because at the time above other things they were making altar breads I think and that is a very demanding task. Another very beautiful and quiet humble Carmel also a 1991 is Clinton township in Michigan. Many of the sisters are elderly but they are a wonderful community. Mother Mary Elizabeth is the prioress in Clinton township. A little suggestion that I did not know when i was very young was to search very carefully for the best fit. Carmels are very small communities and as such the sisters you enter with will be there with you for most of your life so choose wisely what fits your own spiritulity and personality before jumping. There is no getting lost in the crowd in Carmel. It is very true that each Carmel has it's own spirit. All Three have a very joyful spirit. I am sorry this is all I can tell you as it was so long ago. I only know Clinton Township and more intimately Port Tobacco. I was in at a time when the declarations, an experimental form of the constitutions were in effect so things may have stabilized out now since the new definitive constitutions have been put in place. I hope this helps a little and has not added to your confusion. 1990 or 1991 they both have their strengths and weaknesses. But if you are looking for perfection, you will not find it on this side of the earth so be realistic. Take your time in discerning and God will lead you to the right place if you truly have a call to Carmel. Tenderly, Indwelling Trinity Tenderly Edited October 30, 2009 by Indwelling Trinity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InHisLove726 Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 Thank you for your answer, Indwelling Trinity. I have researched several, including those that you mentioned, and even sent a letter to Clinton Township asking for more information, however, the information I received didn't spark any interest for me personally. I have never contacted Port Tobacco, though. I am leaning more towards the Carmels who follow the 1990 Constitutions but trying to keep an open heart in case I am called to the 1991s. They are still Carmels, after all, it's just their expression of the Carmelite life is a little different. One thing I thought was interesting is that the Terre Haute Carmel does not have extern sisters, so the sisters take turns running errands and I am not sure if I'd like this. I like the monasteries that have externs so the cloistered sisters only have to leave for doctor's appointments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humbleheart Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Terre Haute Carmel was the first Carmelite monastery that I discovered. If I lived in America, I would write to them. As it is, I'm in the UK, and there are plenty of monasteries over here waiting to be filled. They look absolutely beautiful, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer G. Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Terre Haute and Port Tobacco were probably my top two choices before learning of 1990 and 1991 carmels. (Don't worry, they're still in my top 10! ) I looked at Terre Haute's webpage, and yes, they do seem very active. Although, I'm not sure about Mass being at 5:00pm (kind of late in the day, I would think) [quote name='Indwelling Trinity' date='30 October 2009 - 06:25 AM' timestamp='1256894731' post='1993835'] Terre Haute is a beautiful Carmel, but a very busy one. They are 1991 constituions and as i know of still retain the full habit. Many of the sisters are skilled artisans I beleive. I too way back when in the past was very drawn to them but wound up entering Port Tobacco in Maryland where the former Prioress, Mother Mary Joseph was from Terre Haute. Mother has since recently gone on to her reward. Port Tobacco was also a beautiful Carmel in which the sisters lived in separate hermitages, although they still follow the 1991 constitutions. The novices live their first years in a novitiate before going to the hermitages. However except for one hermit day a week the life is as a 1991 Carmel. Mother Virginia marie was my novice Mistress at Port Tobacco and is celebrating her 75 anniversary today. she is a sprightly beautiful soul. [/quote] I've looked at Port Tobacco, being in Maryland. Do they choose religious names? The ones listed on their website didn't seem to have religious names. Do the nuns each live in individual hermitages permenantly, or is that more of a "retreat" for the nuns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humbleheart Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 [quote name='Jennifer G.' date='31 October 2009 - 12:22 AM' timestamp='1256944926' post='1994129'] Terre Haute and Port Tobacco were probably my top two choices before learning of 1990 and 1991 carmels. (Don't worry, they're still in my top 10! ) I looked at Terre Haute's webpage, and yes, they do seem very active. Although, I'm not sure about Mass being at 5:00pm (kind of late in the day, I would think) [/quote] Interestingly, I quite like the thought of such a late Mass - you would have all day to look forward to it, and prepare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InHisLove726 Posted October 31, 2009 Author Share Posted October 31, 2009 [quote name='Jennifer G.' date='30 October 2009 - 07:22 PM' timestamp='1256944926' post='1994129'] I've looked at Port Tobacco, being in Maryland. Do they choose religious names? The ones listed on their website didn't seem to have religious names. Do the nuns each live in individual hermitages permenantly, or is that more of a "retreat" for the nuns? [/quote] Actually, I've discussed this with someone else before. The Port Tobacco Carmelites do, in fact, choose religious names. One time, someone said that they noticed a "Sr. Barbara." There is a [url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02284d.htm"]St. Barbara[/url]. Their current prioress, as evidenced in the newsletter on their website, is Mother Virginia Marie. This is most likely a play on "Virgin." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indwelling Trinity Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 (edited) [quote name='InHisLove726' date='30 October 2009 - 09:51 PM' timestamp='1256950298' post='1994156'] Actually, I've discussed this with someone else before. The Port Tobacco Carmelites do, in fact, choose religious names. One time, someone said that they noticed a "Sr. Barbara." There is a [url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02284d.htm"]St. Barbara[/url]. Their current prioress, as evidenced in the newsletter on their website, is Mother Virginia Marie. This is most likely a play on "Virgin." [/quote] This must be an old newsletter as Mother Virginia just told me a month ago she was not prioress anymore but Novice Mistress. And yes they do choose religious names at Port Tobacco. Mother Virginia Marie is her religious name her Baptismal name is very different. Tenderly, Indwelling Trinity Edited October 31, 2009 by Indwelling Trinity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indwelling Trinity Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 Most Carmels i know of no longer have externs maybe with the exception of some of the 1990's However Clinton Township has an extern sister... laughing but she does not drive so Mother must drive the sisters to the doctor. As for Port Tobacco, they have many Lay people who help with those tasks. In port tobacco The sisters live in separate hermitages but as i said before they live the regular communal life of Carmel which means Office, Meals , Mass, and recreation together. Spiritual reading is done in one's cell but because they are 1991's they have the option of making at least one hour of prayer either in the choir, hermitage, or sometimes outside in nature. This is more typical of the flexibility of the 1991's as well as a weekly hermit day. In the 1990's generally prayer is made together in choir for both hours and hermit days tend not to be weekly. Correction to my first post. Mother Virginia is celebrating her 75 birthday today not anniversary. She celebrated her golden jubilee last year. Mea culpa! tenderly, Indwelling Trinity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InHisLove726 Posted October 31, 2009 Author Share Posted October 31, 2009 [quote name='Indwelling Trinity' date='30 October 2009 - 11:59 PM' timestamp='1256961590' post='1994224'] Most Carmels i know of no longer have externs maybe with the exception of some of the 1990's However Clinton Township has an extern sister... laughing but she does not drive so Mother must drive the sisters to the doctor. As for Port Tobacco, they have many Lay people who help with those tasks. In port tobacco The sisters live in separate hermitages but as i said before they live the regular communal life of Carmel which means Office, Meals , Mass, and recreation together. Spiritual reading is done in one's cell but because they are 1991's they have the option of making at least one hour of prayer either in the choir, hermitage, or sometimes outside in nature. This is more typical of the flexibility of the 1991's as well as a weekly hermit day. In the 1990's generally prayer is made together in choir for both hours and hermit days tend not to be weekly. Correction to my first post. Mother Virginia is celebrating her 75 birthday today not anniversary. She celebrated her golden jubilee last year. Mea culpa! tenderly, Indwelling Trinity [/quote] I have to be honest. I kind of like the idea of the individual hermitages, but I wonder what they do when it snows? LOL! I mean, what if they had a freak blizzard in the middle of the night, and they weren't able to get out of their hermitages? This is just a funny little observation! The monastery I am currently in contact with has extern sisters as they are a 1990 Carmel. I believe they have two. One of them just made their final profession a year or two ago. I talked with Mother about the vocation of an extern, and it was an interesting discussion. I don't think I have that vocation, but I never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChild Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 [quote name='InHisLove726' date='31 October 2009 - 04:36 AM' timestamp='1256989012' post='1994352'] I have to be honest. I kind of like the idea of the individual hermitages, but I wonder what they do when it snows? LOL! I mean, what if they had a freak blizzard in the middle of the night, and they weren't able to get out of their hermitages? This is just a funny little observation! The monastery I am currently in contact with has extern sisters as they are a 1990 Carmel. I believe they have two. One of them just made their final profession a year or two ago. I talked with Mother about the vocation of an extern, and it was an interesting discussion. I don't think I have that vocation, but I never know. [/quote] What did she tel you about the vocation of an extern? When I was with the PCPA they didn't have externs, but the monastery where two of our sisters came from (OLAM in Alabama) have several. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChild Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 [quote name='Indwelling Trinity' date='30 October 2009 - 08:59 PM' timestamp='1256961590' post='1994224'] Most Carmels i know of no longer have externs maybe with the exception of some of the 1990's However Clinton Township has an extern sister... laughing but she does not drive so Mother must drive the sisters to the doctor. As for Port Tobacco, they have many Lay people who help with those tasks. In port tobacco The sisters live in separate hermitages but as i said before they live the regular communal life of Carmel which means Office, Meals , Mass, and recreation together. Spiritual reading is done in one's cell but because they are 1991's they have the option of making at least one hour of prayer either in the choir, hermitage, or sometimes outside in nature. This is more typical of the flexibility of the 1991's as well as a weekly hermit day. In the 1990's generally prayer is made together in choir for both hours and hermit days tend not to be weekly. Correction to my first post. Mother Virginia is celebrating her 75 birthday today not anniversary. She celebrated her golden jubilee last year. Mea culpa! tenderly, Indwelling Trinity [/quote] Traverse City is still 1990s though, arent't they? I could have an outdated list. As far as I know, St. Louis and Salt Lake City are still accepting externs. When I was discerning Carmel about 3 yrs ago, Valparaiso was still accepting externs as well. Those Carmels are the only ones I know about, which may not help... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InHisLove726 Posted October 31, 2009 Author Share Posted October 31, 2009 (edited) [quote name='HisChild' date='31 October 2009 - 01:18 PM' timestamp='1257009537' post='1994414'] What did she tel you about the vocation of an extern? When I was with the PCPA they didn't have externs, but the monastery where two of our sisters came from (OLAM in Alabama) have several. [/quote] She told me that the vocation to be an extern was a vocation within a vocation. You were still very much a nun, but it takes someone very mature and discreet because you are in contact with the outside world on a regular basis. It's also for those really centered in reality because if you aren't meant for the extern life, it can be very lonely since you are often separate from the community. In Buffalo, the extern sisters pray in their own chapel, often "taking back" the Divine Office. It's mostly reserved for the older vocations coming in to the cloister. The youngest extern is, I believe, in her early 30s (Sr. Agnes Marie of the Eternal High Priest). Here's a blog post about the occasion of her solemn vows: http://alicesgrandadventures.blogspot.com/2008/06/sister-agnes-marie-of-eternal-high.html Edited October 31, 2009 by InHisLove726 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indwelling Trinity Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 [quote name='InHisLove726' date='31 October 2009 - 05:54 PM' timestamp='1257022456' post='1994523'] She told me that the vocation to be an extern was a vocation within a vocation. You were still very much a nun, but it takes someone very mature and discreet because you are in contact with the outside world on a regular basis. It's also for those really centered in reality because if you aren't meant for the extern life, it can be very lonely since you are often separate from the community. In Buffalo, the extern sisters pray in their own chapel, often "taking back" the Divine Office. It's mostly reserved for the older vocations coming in to the cloister. The youngest extern is, I believe, in her early 30s (Sr. Agnes Marie of the Eternal High Priest). Here's a blog post about the occasion of her solemn vows: http://alicesgrandadventures.blogspot.com/2008/06/sister-agnes-marie-of-eternal-high.html [/quote] Laughing... thirty an older vocation? I must be ancient! Indwelling Trinity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InHisLove726 Posted October 31, 2009 Author Share Posted October 31, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Indwelling Trinity' date='31 October 2009 - 05:24 PM' timestamp='1257024271' post='1994544'] Laughing... thirty an older vocation? I must be ancient! Indwelling Trinity [/quote] Actually, their age limit is 18 to 35. I don't remember exactly what Mother said about those who are accepted for extern vocations. Edited October 31, 2009 by InHisLove726 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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